Homeless in NYC, suggestions on how to get a job in IT? | Hacker News Reader

Homeless in NYC, suggestions on how to get a job in IT?

38 pointsamagnasco44 comments

22 years old, 19 years' experience with screwing up computers. BA in STEM field, non-CS. Four years' work xp. mostly non-CS. Some small amount of professional xp. setting up office IT. Over a decade of xp. helping people understand what went wrong with their soft. or why their pc "won't work". Basic understanding of how to take hw apart, isolate issue, and put it back together. Very basic understanding of how to build a linux OS from scratch, including kernel options. Few years' entry level xp. with databases. Can design, create, populate, optimize, and trim DB of many different types, from spreadsheets, through Blackbaud CRM, MS Access, and SalesForce, to SPSS and basic R, on many OS. Can design, calculate, question, test, implement and reimplement analytics from pivot tables to multiple regression models. Currently learning how to implement machine learning in R and working my way up to calculus. Want to learn C to build device drivers so my computers work like they should. Some basic LaTeX, 3rd world cert in HTML/CSS. Natively bilingual in both EN and ES, US citizen but lived abroad. Extremely eager to learn and be challenged. Want to work my way up to managing large DB and servers (or preferably stats) within the next 2 years, passing through desktop support if necessary. Could not afford getting any certs yet but I intend to within a year. Can do some basic debugging, have a rPi2 and old MBP, both running Arch Linux, so I have some basic familiarity with everything going horribly wrong. No problem whatsoever with working overtime. 100% ok with cleaning out junk on keyboards for a while to prove myself until I work my way up to "staring at kernel dump in hazy confusion.” Free time at work will mostly be spent learning, reading, failing at scripting cron jobs, or hacking espresso machine. Later on will take night classes towards grad degree. My nonprofit CV: https://www.overleaf.com/read/jccfwqtdsfbd Thank you for taking the time to read through this!

(1) I might suggest getting a rock-solid foundation in just a few things rather than superficial acquaintance with 50 different things. Provided you pick those "just a few things" very carefully.

(2) Do be sure to proofread your written business communications; non-standard abbreviations like "xp", "cert", or "pc" (not capitalized), and a run-on / fragmented sentence style will be instant deal-breakers to many, many people on the hiring side.

Your Stack Overflow CV, in particular, definitely will not work with 98% of regular business employers out there, simply on the basis of the writing style and over-personalization (i.e. the way you make it all about you and your story... rather than the skills you can bring to the table).

(3) Whatever you do, never mention that you're homeless of course. This might get you sympathy from some people on an abstract level -- but a much stronger impulse will force them to compartmentalize, detach their feelings from the situation, and focus on the job they have to do (namely, finding the right person for the role).

Hi Kafaesq, thank you for the tips. I agree 100% with you.

1. Unfortunately I'm slightly past the point where I can get a rock-solid foundation in something, I just need a job. The classes I'm taking I've been focusing on for a while now.

2. My actual CV and cover letters don't read like this, and I had to abbreviate plenty to fit in the 2k character limit here on HN. Opinion on https://www.overleaf.com/read/jccfwqtdsfbd and how I can get my tech skills in there?

3. I agree, and it sucks because it's what my life is like right now. Having to hide it in interviews is ok I guess, but I did want to open up about it here so I could get some advice.

My quick take on your CV is that while it might be fine for applying for, say, an administrative or leadership position at a non-profit or an NGO, it doesn't read at all like a resume someone would want to see in the tech world.

I'd suggest creating a completely different resume for tech positions you're applying to, mentioning your other positions but emphasizing just the technical side of your skill set. However (currently) meager this skill set may be.

Also, to be blunt, not only does no one in the tech world care about graphic design, or self-assessment of generic personal traits (like being able to work outdoors), hobbies, etc -- making a point of these things (or presenting an over-designed resume of any sort) will quite definitely work against you.

As will mentioning experience with LinkedIn as a "skill" comparable to actual programming or devops skills. That will instantly kill your chances at an actual tech position, in fact (again, to be very, very blunt).

BTW it's absolutely no problem for you to mention your being homeless here, in this forum (I've been on the edge of it myself, and can only sympathize). But I would immediately delete any public postings of any sort where your personal story in this front is associate with your real name. Really, it just falls into the category of "too much information" for 99% of the folks out there who are making hiring decisions -- and can only work against you.

Thank you so much for looking over it and giving me your honest opinion. It helps immensely-- I'll write up a new tech-specific CV and post it here.

I agree with your assessment of hiring managers' mindset on that, and am being discreet. I'll even come back and delete my linked CVs as soon as I get a job opportunity.

Best of luck. BTW in your situation (and in fact I was in something pretty close to it, during good stretches of my 20s) I would definitely keep my focus on getting any kind of a job (bike messenger, driver, delivery, whatever), and of course a cheap place to stay, well before winter sets in. Rather than on your ideal job and all that fancy ML stuff.

You'll have plenty of time to think about long-term skill growth and how to best invest in it, how to get around the lack of a tech degree (or perhaps whether it's worth going to school again, after all) once you've got a place to stay and a regular paycheck.

I agree 100%, the problem is that the places that I've been staying haven't had any open opportunities within bike distance, and I don't have a car. I'm moving back to the city, over there it'll be different.

Here's the new CV, opinion? www.overleaf.com/read/zrwcqvgrftvj

Much, much better. Some quick feedback:

(1) Relentlessly check for spelling ("videoconferencing" should be two words), and for correct and consistent use of acronyms ("SUNY Geneseo" should always be written that way, and no other way.

(2) Be careful not to mix (to put it delicately) "brainy" languages like SQL and R with "webby" languages like CSS (or other formatting languages). Even though CSS can in fact be quite tricky, this is a common mistake people applying for junior-ish people make -- experienced people will think that you think these languages have equal "weight" when in their mind they clearly do not. And certainly don't mix them in the same mention as natural languages.

So it would be better to split these into separate bullet points, e.g.:

- Data analysis (intermediate SQL; basic R, SPSS) - Frontend web (intermediate HTML5, CSS); LaTeX - Natively bilingual in English and Spanish

(3) Again, relentlessly check acronyms against their standard spellings (e.g. "GitHub", "csh", "Bash" should always be spelled exactly like that, and no other way). "OS X" has a space in the middle, etc.

(4) "Vim" and "vi" are interchangeably; juste use one or the other.

(5) Use color for hyperlinks only - not headings or anything else. Gratuitous color looks overdesigned to tech people (like you're trying to hard), and will likely be a dealbreaker.

And finally:

(6) If you have a GitHub profile with anything at all of interest in it, by all means, include that up at the very top. But do make sure that whatever is in there meets the same standard for correctness in terms of spelling, case as your resume. (A couple of typos are OK -- but it should look like you care).

Good luck!

I would suggest...

If you're homeless in NYC, there used to be a squatter scene in the Lower East Side. That's changed over the past decades, but ABC No Rio at 156 Rivington used to be a squat, and they have a calendar of open events on their web site. Bluestockings books on 172 Allen St., one block south of Houston Street is open all the time and is not really squatter-oriented, but has people and flyers associated with this scene. Food Not Bombs moved out of ABC No Rio to the Catholic Worker at 36 E. 1st street, they serve free food in Tompkins Square Park after 3:30PM.

Also, 2600 meetings happen on the first Friday of every month in the lobby of 153 E 53rd St, people start coming in at 5PM. They're technical people who might be sympathetic to someone in your situation.

If you look on Craigslist, there are a lot of (Microsoft) desktop support jobs. Some need an A+/MCSE, some don't. It sounds like you could handle things more complex, but if you're in dire need it's a paycheck. Also you have some experience doing that. Do that, learn that, try to save some money up.

In fact if you're homeless you should probably look for an easier to get job like a messenger's job first. Then I'd look for desktop support job. If I was homeless I would put aside learning ML in R until I was getting a steady paycheck and had a roof over my head.

:::::UPDATE::::: we found a way to get there and will absolutely be making use of all these incredible resources, when we get a job and have free time and money we'll go back and help out too

Wow, this is amazing. Thank you so much for all the information, I'm literally crying right now. Can I ask how you know all this?

After the better part of a year in this situation in Florida, I managed to get a friend to put us up two hours north of NYC, but there was a change of plans and we need to leave by next week. So all those amazing people are slightly out of reach right now but we'll definitively go if we manage to get to NYC, but we can't because there's no-one we can stay with.

The main problem we have right now is Catch-22. We need a job to pay rent for a roof over our heads or buy food. We need a roof and food to apply for jobs. We don't have any more savings left to keep us coasting by, any more family left that can help, or any more friends that can put us up. We managed to stay off the streets up until now but it doesn't seem like an option anymore. No-one wants to put us up, even for the promise of back-paid rent, and no-one wants to give us a job. We're at wits' end, really. We have two college degrees each for christ's sake. If we were in NYC proper we could go in person to do all of those things but we're not. I completely agree with your assessment and will definitively start looking on craigslist. Re: R, doing some programming once in a while between applications keeps me sane, which is absolutely a priority right now. I don't know why I just wrote out all of this, sorry.. thanks for all the advice

I neglected to mention, FNB only serves food in Tompkins Square Park on Sunday.

In your situation, forget about a job that involves R machine learning, unless you already have an in. Get a job as a messenger, or supermarket stocker, or McDonalds burger flipper or something. Look for signs in stores that say help wanted, or find Manhattan messengering services you can work at.

Don't look for an apartment. Look for a room to rent.

There are different recycling days in New York, and some supermarkets have 24/7 recycling machines. You can take cans from people's blue recycle bins, put it in a container (the street collectors use a basket with wheels around here) and 20 of them means a dollar.

Also - on Staten Island is a place called Ganas. Some people work in their stores and live there. They own residential buildings, stores etc. Some people live there and work elsewhere. I don't know if they have space available, if you tell them you'd like to live there and work in their stores, and perhaps one of you eventually would get an outside job (or maybe both), it might work out. The inner circle of Ganas is slightly cultish, but lots of people come to New York, live there a few months, then go somewhere else, and had a good time of it. They don't push you too heavily to join their meditation circle or whatever it is. There used to be a Ganas splinter group with a building near Ganas with a building, I don't think they owned businesses though. The living is cheap, communal etc., but it's a roof and a job, and some of them have outside jobs.

The city places homeless people, but if you're a walkin you'll probably be sent to a homeless shelter with a lot of mentally ill and criminal people. People get their stuff stolen, sometimes worse. There is a curfew too, although if you have a legit job it might be extended.

Find a public shower and a place where you can wash clothes cheap. Go to the public library and send CV's out all day - day after day (until you get a job). Use the public shower and fresh clothes every day for first month working. With first salary check get a flat.

Had to do that 2 times, once in my home country (non IT job), second time i moved to a country without money and had to do it again (IT job).

Cheers

That is exactly the plan! At the moment we found a friend of mine to crash with but it's ending next week. I'm sorry that you had to go through that too but at least you got out! It's really encouraging, thanks for sharing

If you're down to relocate, we're based out of Malaysia and growing fast. Sounds like you might be a cultural fit.

https://vase.ai/careers/

P.s. We might be able to help with the flight ticket if you're an interesting candidate. And Malaysia's cost of living is just way cheaper :D

That sounds fantastic! I've always wanted to go there. I have to be upfront, neither me nor my girlfriend know Malay but we could probably pick up some Chavacano or creole quickly.

I looked on your website-- I like it! Operations intern sounds good. I'm applying, thanks for letting me know!

Hey @amagnasco,

I was hoping you'd consider the full-stack developer role actually, given your clear interest in infrastructure. To clarify, that is a paid position, without the "expect no pay until you prove your value" condition, as we just really need good tinkerers right now.

Also, given your background in PoliSci and your current interest in R and machine learning, I could also definitely see you in an analyst's role. We don't have that up on our careers page yet, but as I've mentioned above, we're open to creating a role for you if you are a good fit. :D

Browsing through the career offers: "Expect no pay until you prove your value."... Hmm, nice, let's go to Malaysia and see if I'll get paid...

ah didn't notice that, thanks...

Hey @antoineMoPa,

Sorry if that rubs you the wrong way. That expectation applies to only one career option, the "I'm really smart" option. We put this in because we want people who want to join Vase, but do not see themselves in any of the positions currently offered, to pitch us what position they want, and why they're a really good fit for it.

Given the nature of creating a position specifically for a candidate, I think it is a fair expectation on that candidate to prove why that position is necessary in Vase, and also what value they bring, hence the "Expect no pay until you prove your value."

That being said, the position that @amagnasco expressed interest in, Operations Intern, is definitely paid, as are all the other defined positions we have.

I'd love to pick your brain if there is a better way we can do this though @antoineMoPa. We want to attract great people, and know that sometimes they may not see themselves in a software engineer/sales executive/data analyst role, (which is what we have on offer), and this seemed like the best way to attract driven people who will create their own role in the company.

Do you have any ideas?

You need to cut down on the noise. You mention so many things that it's hard to figure out "who you are". Would be nice to have something tangible you worked on that would give you instant credibility.

Wouldn't mention that you're homeless. As long as you can seem similar and likable to the founders you can talk your way into most startup jobs (if that's what you're after). So I'd mostly focus on the image you're projecting.

Ah... that's really the problem... I've worked on a lot of stuff in a lot of different fields. I could be entry level in writing, editing, research, IT. I could also be junior management at a large nonprofit. Hell, I could be senior management at a small nonprofit. The problem is I have 1 good CV and I highlight my relevance in the cover letter according to the job. I just can't seem to get past the automatic keyword screening, even using jobscan.co

would this work? www.overleaf.com/read/zrwcqvgrftvj

Well I don't know much about CVs and that sort of hiring. I was mostly concerned about your own possible confusion about who you'd like to be. You still seem to list a lot of "random" technologies rather than just operating on high level concepts. I.e. just saying you know networking rather than "iptables, firewalls..." [0]. I really don't know if that's a good strategy job-application wise or not, no idea.

I was imagining you just finding a way to network with startup people, making some friends and eventually getting a job. Especially since you mention you're willing to do anything [for I assume not so much pay] Applying for jobs is definitely an unlikely path to such an arrangement.

[0] and btw mentioning firewalls and iptables separately in that context is werid unto itself

Since online applications haven't been working out for me, I'm going to start going in person, so I wrote the CV with that perspective in mind.

I don't know about CVs either, at all really. I know the limits of my knowledge and I don't want to oversell myself, I just wanted to clarify what I do and don't know. My experience is heavily linux-based so if someone is looking for a windows expert to debug their registers, that's not me. Sure I can poke around and apply critical thinking to the issue, go online and download a new dat file, reinstall the OS, virus scans or whatever, but I've never debugged a VB app. I don't even know what else is out there in the windowsverse past that point. If tinkering got me nowhere, it's not in the manual, and it's not online, I'll pass it on to someone else. As opposed to linux, OSX, BSD debugging which I can handle fine.

Thanks for pointing the firewall thing out, I fixed it.

Meetup.com

Find tech events in Manhattan/Brooklyn and show up for the free food and soak up as much as you can from the people giving talks.

You'll meet people who might be hiring, or maybe their company is hiring. And even if you don't, you'll be learning cool shit and eating free food!

This really helps, thanks! Take care

Adding to this: the Bitcoin center in NYC has (or had, it's been some time) Satoshi Square every Monday & Thursday, which is a meetup/trading event. Free entry, free pizza, free bar.

I think the scene has died down a bit, but if there's even a fraction of the energy left you'll have a good time and make a few solid business connections.

Long time lurker here. Sorry for the lack of intelligible paragraphs and for all the abbreviations. I had to fit it under 2000 characters.

A more reader-friendly version is at http://stackoverflow.com/cv/amagnasco

You write in your CV "Want to learn C to build device drivers so my computers work like they should". Why do you want to write your own device drivers? Because there is hardware you want to use (e.g. under Linux) for which adequate free device drivers don't exist? (What hardware?) Because existing device drivers have bugs or limitations that no one has fixed? (Can you give an example?)

If I was doing hiring, the way you worded that would make me suspicious that you don't really have a good understanding of the reasons why in practice people develop device drivers. You could avoid that impression if you were more specific about a device you want to write a driver for (e.g. "I bought a Thingymabob9000, but I can't use it under Linux because only Windows drivers are available for it"). Since the vast majority of IT jobs don't actually involve device driver development, any limitations of your understanding in this area are probably irrelevant; but it is better you avoid inducing a negative impression in others even if it is irrelevant to the job (unconciously we tend to still consider things even if we know consciously they are irrelevant.) Or you could just avoid mentioning the topic of writing device drivers altogether-better to not bring up a topic on which your knowledge might have some gaps than bring it up only for the hiring manager to get the impression that you have a poor understanding of it.

Sorry about not being more specific in there, you're absolutely right. I wouldn't mention it in an actual CV or cover letter, I just wanted to put it on here so you can see my long-term interest in CS, that it's not just to pay the bills.

As a general issue my hardware is mostly old and crappy, while most of it does have foss linux drivers the specific configuration for some is quite impossible to manage. I've been trying to figure it out with a lot of AL experts on the forums for some years now. So my interest in that would be learning how drivers work so I can actually configure them properly, helping rewrite the documentation, and maybe helping rewrite the drivers themselves if necessary. Probably the first step would be learning how to get a working Gentoo system up, as I spend a lot of time reading their documentation anyway. For example, the 2011 MacBook Pro has two video cards: an integrated Intel HD Graphics 3000, and a discrete AMD Radeon HD 6750M. It works like * even on OSX (it literally froze up on me for 15 minutes while I was writing this post), but on Arch I can't even get it to run so I just use single-user mode and do everything from bash. Unfortunately as fun as Mutt and Elinks are, I can't apply to jobs using that so I'm forced to run OSX.

As a specific interest there's a lot of areas that intrigue me in the realm of FOSS development for ARM (and HURD!).

Changes to CV:

> First up put an objective of what your objective in 1-2 lines. (eg: System/Web/Mobile developer looking for beginner level role - something in this line)

> Next pull your fluent skill levels from second page sidebar to first page on main-side. By this, reviewer will quickly be able to see your tech skills first up (right in viewing zone).

> Show some code in your github profile - as you can program - write some neat code for problems in codejam, topcoder, careercup etc. If you have already 've some code - push it to a github.

> Put your SAT scores and college education in viewing zone - 1st page.

> Divide your tech skills by [ system, web, mobile ]. Skill with highest proficiency cam come at beginning.

Cut down on what you want to do ahead (but let that burn within you till reach the goal) in resume as it will not help now. Also search for sample programmer CVs and see if anything helps you organise content in a better way in FIRST PAGE.

Then in second page - rest of the things can come.

Left hand section of cv - content looks dense with paragraphs of texts. See if you can put it in less words.

Apply through as many webportals as possible. Search career section of companies if you have any in mind.

Push hard and trudge on - do not stop.

Amazing, thank you so much! On it right now! This helps immensely!

New CV, thoughts? www.overleaf.com/read/zrwcqvgrftvj

Good :).

Can be better. Replace SysAdmin with System Admin.

First 3 paras will be better like below - (each '>' is a bullet): > Programming languages: SQL, HTML, CSS, BASH, R, SPSS/PSPP, LaTeX space languages. > Version control : Git [insert link of your account]. > Editor: Vim, Vi, Emacs. > Tools and Applications: SalesForce, Raiser's Edge, Blackbaud CRM systems, Asana, Overleaf, Slack, MS office. > Operating systems : Arch Linux, Ubuntu, Red Hat, OSX, and Windows, Gnome, Unity, LXDE, XFDE, CISC and RISC systems. > Networking: DHCP, routers configuration.

Activities: > Installing and setting up operating systems (windows & linux flavoured). > Installing and troubleshooting hardware and software. > Purchasing, and negotiating with vendors. > Excellent customer service, in person or remote. > Partitioning and disk recovery, both GUI and shell. IPtables, firewalls. Antiviral, rootkit, periferal, and social engineering safety measures, both preventative and corrective.

When you see paragraphs of text in CV - think in bullets and subheadings. Golden rule - keep each point within a line or two.

Hope all goes well for you. Good luck.

Thank you so much for all this advice! It still seemed a bit dreary so I put some of the more marketable items in bold, I guess I can change that on the fly to suit wherever I'm applying to. Thanks and likewise!

There are tips here for how to get a mailing address, etc:

http://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/

You aren't yet literally on the street. I suggest you not tell people you are homeless. Get a mailing address and dirt cheap phone and apply for work.

Get better at leaving out the personal details. They are pertinent to you. They are mostly not anything a potential employer wants to hear.

Best.

Thank you, everything helps. I agree completely with you, the actual CV I send out is linked at the end of the post, and I'll upload a tech-specific one now based on suggestions here.

For the past year I've been constantly on the brink of being on the street or worse and have been fighting tooth and nail to get even a sofa or any help at all. The vast majority of my family are back in South America and have problems of their own to deal with, my friends are not doing that much better. It sucks. No-one I'm applying for a job with would hear about any of it though of course.

Well, I have been camped in a tent for 4.5 years. I openly self identify as "homeless" online, but it isn't a good way to get real respect from most people and Hacker News is a professional forum and a place some people manage to get work. (That link (above) is my website.)

On the first of the month here, they do a thing where you can post that you are a freelancer or an employer seeking a freelancer. That is coming up in a few days. You might check that out.

You should also look for gig work. By 2020, 40% of US workers are expected to be doing gig work of some kind. Regular jobs are becoming less common. I have been doing gig work and my income is trending up while on the street. I do freelance writing, part time and intermittently (due to health issues). That is gradually leading to better things for me.

Best.

That's incredible, I don't even know what to say. I'm looking at your website and it really is very useful, thanks for putting it up. I'll spread the word around about it when I get to the city.

I've done some grant-writing work on Upwork, and I'm trying to get into other writing opportunities for gigs. Is there anywhere you recommend for that, in particular that doesn't scam people? I will definitively come back Aug 1st and check out that thread, thanks. That reddit definitively is interesting...

I remember when Amazon started Mturk and all of a sudden, the gig economy hit the internet. Visionary, really.

http://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/2016/02/a-...

I'm a few hours north of the city, but if you need clothes I probably have a bunch, your size depending.

You're amazing, thank you! We're good on clothes thank god, we've been taking care of them. Hopefully by the time winter rolls around we'll be in a better position to get some new stuff. Seriously, thank you though.

If the winter rolls around and you are in need, my e-mail is in my profile. Happy to make the drive down to help a fellow human being.

:::::::::::UPDATE:::::::::::

Thank you everyone for all of your amazing advice! It really is helping me immensely, I cannot thank you enough..

New CV incorporating your suggestions: www.overleaf.com/read/zrwcqvgrftvj

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Some feedback... Should be a one page resume. No wall of text as the interviewer will spend one minute looking at your resume and your need to grab their attention. Emphasize the skill set the particular job opening is looking for. Make it a short list of bullet points that are easy to read.

Don't list too many skills if your don't have in-depth experience. Each interviewer will pick a few from that list to quiz you and you are bound to fail if your have minimal experience. Keep only the ones you are most comfortable and proud about your accomplishments.

If you have good GPA or SAT scores then emphasize them.

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