Comment by fnid2 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by fnid2 | Hacker News Reader

[Google] must follow Chinese law and international custom, and responsibly handle the aftermath

Momma always told me, "Pick your battles." I am not sure this is the right battle to be picking. The Chinese don't play around. They recently executed a British national for drug crimes: http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,669573,00.... They sentenced a corrupt business woman to death: http://www.mainjustice.com/2009/12/18/china-to-execute-woman... According to that same article they also execute for tax evasion. Also, the food safety guy for taking bribes: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6286698.stm

I'm no fan of Google and I hope my bias isn't clouding my rationale here, but I'm not really sure this is the right battle to pick. China isn't Microsoft. They aren't Apple. China is a sovereign nation with laws that should be respected. If you don't respect their laws, don't do business there. Can it be any simpler than that? Is there a moral justification for Google's behavior that I'm missing?

I can't help but think our government's wishy-washy attitude toward the enforcement of law has convinced our business leaders that they are above it. In many ways, they are above the law in the U.S., but not in China.

Google has unfairly threatened the lives and freedom of their employees in China. There's no bluffing in a game like this. Even rationally speaking, I think it's quite irresponsible of Google to do this.

If Google thinks they are going to change Chinese society or Chinese law or get away with behavior like this, they're delusional.

I'd like to suggest a book for Google executives, it's called Kiss, Bow, or Shake Hands http://www.kissboworshakehands.com/2004GTC/index.html

"If you don't respect their laws, don't do business there."

Uh, so it looks like they turned the lights off on the offending piece of software. Now the ball is in Chinas court as to weather or not they block the redirect.

China likes to shy away from Global Embarrassment. I don't think anyone from Google China will be executed.

I'd be surprised if Google didn't offer each of their employees in China to leave the company before they made the announcement that they were going to cease censoring the Internet. I'm sure that several took it. However, if there was a similar case in the United States, many would be willing to put their lives on the line to affirm the necessity of free speech. Please don't cheapen the decisions of the employees to stay onboard as Google employees by suggesting that Google has held them hostage. They are making a statement that, whether or not the Chinese government decided to go after them, they are on the right side.

No. China isn't Apple or Microsoft. Apple and Microsoft aren't evil. They don't violate human rights as China does. Doesn't that make the fight against China the correct battle to choose?

Sorry for my idealism, but I seriously believe that Google made the right choice, as did the employees in China who decided to stand by Google's side in defense of freedom.

Many Americans lack respect for cultures that are not considered European. They have been brainwashing into believing that their culture is "the best". They do not study history and know little of social studies. I think this stems from a disease called "the white man's burden." American's must understand and respect that their "way" is not the only "way" or the best "way".When you try to use false pretense to further your own private agendas that looks bad; and to insult the intelligence (disrespect) of the Chinese it looks really bad.

Many Americans lack respect for cultures that are not considered European.

I am an exception to that generalization. I have devoted much of my life to the study of Chinese culture and language, and have lived overseas for years at a time. But what I know about the Chinese people I know is that they too like good governance and freedom, and I hope they get more of each in the coming generation.

"China is a sovereign nation with laws that should be respected."

Why?

Because we expect foreign entities doing business in our sovereign nation to respect our laws. The golden rule, so to speak.

Why should 'laws' decreed anywhere be respected?

Should laws that are counter to one's values be respected?

Should laws that seek to prevent a full human experience be respected?

Should we continue to support the artificial constructs of nation-states? Why?

>Why should 'laws' decreed anywhere be respected? Punishments!

>Should laws that are counter to one's values be respected? From the individual's point of view, they will have a unique risk-vs-reward threshold value for each 'law', and if its smaller then a corresponding risk-vs-reward ratio such as 'the harshness of punishment x rate of discovery / gains from breaking law', then they will break it.

>Should laws that seek to prevent a full human experience be respected?

I think your question is very general, for example I do not share the values of a psychopath serial killer, even if killing to the killer is their definition of 'full human experience'.

>Should we continue to support the artificial constructs of nation-states? Why?

To the individual from a practical point of view, supporting or non-supporting is a non-issue - its only when a significant or critical mass of people feel disdain for a government or leadership will change occur, and inevitably it will morph in to another nation-state construct, thats how history is like.

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