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Comment by logicallee | Hacker News Reader

I liked it better when Y Combinator was giving this kind of money[1] out to founders who could use it to build a business. Old text: "In 2005, Y Combinator developed a new model of startup funding. Twice a year we invest a small amount of money (average $18k) in a large number of startups (currently 82)" I note that $2k/month for 12 months is $24k, so that's more than their old investment size.

Meanwhile, now, it's calling its investments of $120K a "small amount of money"[2], while calling this kind of money ($24K for a year) a basic "income" and not actually treating it as an investment. This bothers me.

[1] http://web.archive.org/web/20120614131411/http://ycombinator...

[2] http://www.ycombinator.com/

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YC is still making these investments, they are simultaneous working to save the middle class because without that group of people we will have a lot less startups. I think what they are trying is important enough to risk some cash on and I'm eager to see how it pans out over the next couple of years.

if it were making such investments in the same spirit as before, it wouldn't also call $120K a "small amount of money" on its front page. I think what I object to is the silent change from investing an average of $18K to investing $120K and still calling the latter a small amount of money. It's really not.

also let's be clear: from an investment standpoint, investing $12K instead of $120K means that startups can do ten times worse while still being a free investment. put another way: a tenth as many need to succeed to be free. People behave very differently under such conditions of risk!

Also investing $12K made them an investor of first, last, and only resort for startups that needed that. sorry, anecdotally this is actual fact.

granted, this does not describe most startups, just a few.

In some countries $18 thousand dollars would feed their family for years.

Americans are so sheltered many have broken minds.

Agreed. I'm a broke developer who would love nothing more than a small living stipend to work on my own projects and contribute to open source. If I had just enough to get by and be able to code all day I would be so happy.

So basically you are one who would benefit from a basic income. Why is a "living stipend to work on [your] own projects" better than a basic income which too would allow you to work on your own projects?

I hope with a little thought, you can come to see the difference between formally investing in a startup which is trying to get off the ground, and handing someone an income no questions asked...

To put it in simple terms, you get what you pay for. If you invest in someone's startups, they'll deliver a startup (or fail); if you invest in someone's lifestyle, they'll deliver a lifestyle (or fail).

It's what makes a broke college student asking their parents for some money different from a homeless person who has just spent the money he had left on alcohol, asking for some money.

I am probably running a high risk of being misinterpreted. When a programmer becomes homeless and needs money, then that money is different from when someone who got out of prison for beating someone up has no money.

basic income makes it sound like the latter; whereas building a business is a lot more like the former.

you can disagree, but please do so eloquently.

> To put it in simple terms, you get what you pay for. If you invest in someone's startups, they'll deliver a startup (or fail); if you invest in someone's lifestyle, they'll deliver a lifestyle (or fail).

Whether this is true or not is exactly what needs to be figured out. So far, this is just a prejudice.

> When a programmer becomes homeless and needs money, then that money is different from when someone who got out of prison for beating someone up has no money.

And if that person just out of prison was a programmer? Would that change something? What exactly makes a programmer better than anyone who served his time and deserves a chance?

> I hope with a little thought [...] you can disagree, but please do so eloquently

Sorry, neither thinking nor eloquence are my forte. But I did indeed work with homeless people and ex-convicts. Try it and you might see they are people too.

one of the great business discoveries of the past few hundred years is that people respond to incentives. I won't respond to the rest of your comments.

Be careful, though, sometimes "code all day" is actually a form of addiction and...in the end of it all...you'll end up possibly unhappy, take it from me :|

To test this hypothesis, try not coding for a couple weeks, and avoiding other possibly addictive habits. See if you go through a "withdrawal" as it were...best of luck to you and us both!

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