If the premise of this article were true, then lifting the ban would be a major legislative priority for the airlines and likely already be lifted.
[0] https://books.google.com/books?id=7E-c6ni5MfYC&pg=PA107&lpg=...
If the premise of this article were true, then lifting the ban would be a major legislative priority for the airlines and likely already be lifted.
[0] https://books.google.com/books?id=7E-c6ni5MfYC&pg=PA107&lpg=...
We don't know if the cost/benefit math works out until people are able to try.
Even ignoring differences in sub/supersonic flight (i.e., being unrealistically conservative), doubling my cruise speed to mach 1.5 would've increased fuel consumption by 4x while bringing my total travel time down to around 4 hours. So it'd be (probably significantly more than) 4x the cost just to reduce my travel time by 30%. Again, that's for the "best case" of coast-to-coast travel.
How'd you manage to spend (average) only 45 minutes in the airport on each end? Even pre-TSA, I never managed to go from front door to jetway that fast.
One time as a non-passenger I went through security at BDL two or three times either because of confusion about where to meet someone or just in order to buy food on the other side. The security guards didn't seem to think this was improper.
Then again, I also remember when kids were routinely let into the cockpit, either before takeoff or while cruising.
Air travel used to be almost fun.
Ah well, it seems that those days will never return.
I still remember when I was fortunate enough to failover to a concorde when our 747 was grounded ~20 years ago and got to visit the cockpit in flight. There was a seam between two portions of the cockpit (a little less than an inch wide) that only existed when the plane was supersonic, and it closed tight when not.
Wouldn't have been able to scare a kid into thinking they could get their hand stuck in there if the plane was still on the ground ;)
Of course whether or not in-flight cockpit visits were still allowed, that particular experience wouldn't happen anymore.
I wasn't a kid, but I got to hang out in the cockpit for a good-half hour on a cross-province Air Canada flight long after it was illegal in USA airspace (1990s). The amazing thing, apart from the scenery, was that you could see dozens of other jets in various headings and altitudes.
Apparently in the 1960s to early 1970s, you could buy your ticket on the plane. (I wasn't around to have experienced that.)
However, an hour and a half to get in with TSA "at your service" feels like cutting it really close, and I'm talking about "Smurf" (SMF), not San Francisco or San Jose.
I missed a few flights doing this but pre-9/11 it was definitely possible (but not advisable) to get to a smaller airport 30-45 minutes before departure and make the flight.
On the arrival side, back in the good old days (mid to late 90's?) with no checked luggage I could get from the arrival gate to Hertz #1 club gold rental car pickup (when it was in the terminal A garage) at SJC without breaking stride - probably 5 minutes max from the aircraft door to car door.
Nowadays OAK has been expanded and the security lines are longer (and they have body scanners, which I opt out of, which also then takes longer).
I still remember worrying about how close we cut it, but he'd done it many times and knew how long it would take.
With precheck, most airports aren't much worse, other than the uncertainty of transport in. I've never had precheck take me longer than about 10 minutes in security. So as long as I'm not checking a bag, it's still pretty reasonable to arrive 45min before departure.
"Things are bad here, but the good news is it's worse everywhere else." \s
I like SFO.
Here's a map with travel times: http://www.trulia.com/local/94128/driving:1%7Ctransit:0%7Cpo...
But anyway, I was talking about the entrance.
30 minutes would barely get you from central SF to the airport ramp with a mostly empty 101.
But that's not the problem. Getting parked and a shuttle in will be at least 45 minutes, if you get a shuttle faster than normal.
Taking BART to SFO entrance: check the schedules. You'll be surprised how much of the day it doesn't run at all.
I may have always gotten lucky and when I actually plan the trip I try to go for more like 45min travel-to-airport-time. Just to be sure.
On Thanksgiving or such, the off-ramp from 101 to SFO takes about an hour. That's crazy.
Also, when flying to Sacramento recently I took the Norwegian Air trip from Gatwick to Oakland and then capitol corridor to Sacramento. Didn't even need to get on BART; the airport connector took me to the catwalk to Amtrak.
The only airport in the bay that seems hard to access is San Jose, which has less service anyway.
They kind of have to advertise the worst wait times though because if they say 1 hour non peak and 3 hours peak the times the airport or the traveler gets it wrong the airport will catch the blame.
ATL on the other hand....even with TSA pre I can take a full hour.
In fact in some contests these private guards performed 5x better than TSA employees in catching the bad guys/bad items while actually doing it lot faster.
I don't even want to think about trying to get through at a reasonable hour.
Extremely lucky (mistake on person who bought my ticket's end) but it happened.
That is true. If someone had told me about Uber 15 years ago I would have called that person mad. I never thought it was even possible to run a taxi company bypassing all the taxi regulations in place.
But having said that what really matters is the marginal value of time during coast to coast flight. At the moment it takes me on an average 10 hours to travel from SF to NY including the time spending in planning, traveling to airport, NSA bullshit etc. 4 hours is the actual flight time. If it is reduced to 2 hours I don't really benefit much. I still have to spend 8 hours.
There's a lot of international travel from the US:
http://travel.trade.gov/view/m-2016-O-001/index.html
Now LAX to Europe becomes easier. NYC to Asia gets much better.
NYC to London wasn't enough of a savings with the Concorde for many people. NYC to Tokyo/Shanghai/Beijing/Sydney/Singapore/Seoul/Mumbai would probably have more value, for example.
Also, LAX to London or Paris is about 10.5 hours. I'd think a market that cuts that to under 5 hours would exist.
So basically my point is this: the FAA has no jurisdiction over the vast majority of those routes.
And very crudely, I think about 20% of the great circle route is over the US and hence in the FAA's jurisdiction. They're already allowed to fly supersonic over much of Northern Canada, and the great circle comes over Hudson Bay and to North Dakota (passing near Winnipeg)—that's the only section outwith the FAA's jurisdiction where they are not already allowed to fly supersonic I believe.
Concorde demand wasn't typically driven by need; it was mostly driven by prestige.
I actually find long flights are a good time to catch up on things that don't require me to be online. (Whether work-related or not.)
For example, if I have a recording studio under the flight path, do I get more compensation in order to add sound-proofing?
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/preserving-sile... describes "a Natural Sounds Program .. with the aim of protecting and promoting the appreciation of park soundscapes."
> In Sequoia and Kings Canyon National Parks, which have a major naval air station to the west and a large military air training space to the east, park officials take military commanders on a five-day "Wilderness Orientation Overflight Pack Trip" to demonstrate the effects of military jet noise on visitor experience in the parks. Before the program started in the mid-1990s, rangers reported as many as 100 prohibited "low flier" incidents involving military jets every year. Now the number of planes flying less than 3000 feet above the ground surface is a fourth to a fifth of that. Complaints are taken seriously, especially when, as has happened more than once, they're radioed in by irate military commanders riding on jet-spooked pack horses on narrow mountain trails. In that context, human cursing is generally regarded as a natural sound.
How do you charge for that?
> For example, if I have a recording studio under the flight path, do I get more compensation in order to add sound-proofing?
No, but maybe you could sell out and move somewhere without that noise, and someone who is noise-tolerant would happily take your place + the compensation on offer.
It's the same with any sort of pollution - what's the minimum I can pay someone in order to put up a insert smelly, explosive, noisy, etc. factory? Or to put in off-shore windmills which affects peoples' sea views? Or schedule airport takeoffs at 2am?
(I forgot another complication: does the payment go to the landowner or to the resident? Or both?)
Regarding "likely better than a blanket ban", a goal is to develop methods that reduce the effect of the sonic boom "to make overland flight acceptable." This is also better than a blanket ban, and doesn't require a new way to approximate impact costs and manage payments.
You can't put the cart before the horse. You have to get rid of the ban in order to make the whole thing worthwhile.
> Except for Concorde airplanes having flight time before January 1, 1980, no person may operate in the United States, a civil supersonic airplane that does not comply with Stage 2 noise limits of part 36 in effect on October 13, 1977, using applicable trade-off provisions.
Going back to an article from 1973, at http://elr.info/news-analysis/3/10067/faa-promulgates-strict... :
> The policy underlying this regulation puts the burden of establishing the environmental acceptability of supersonic civil aircraft flight on the proponent, rather than on the affected public. However, the FAA has also made available reasonable opportunity for aircraft manufacturers to prove the environmental acceptability of supersonic flight if they are able to control sonic boom research without harmful effects on the public.
The problem appears to be that airplane manufacturers cannot meet the existing noise level, so instead want the FAA to say what higher level is allowed. This places the cost and responsibility on the government rather than the manufacturers. So of course the manufacturers would like to shift that expense to someone else.
What about 1 per day? 10 per day? 100 per day? What are the limits? Who determines the limits? Who bears the burden of dealing with the pollution - sludge or noise - and how are their voices heard?
As I pointed out elsewhere, the existing prohibition does not appear to be a "blanket ban". If your supersonic plane is sufficiently quiet, I believe it is allowed to fly. The problem is that we don't know how to build planes which are that quiet. What's at issue is who pays for figuring out which higher noise levels are acceptable - industry or the government. And industry doesn't like the current government answer.
My house was in the flight path (about a mile from the airport as the plane flies; neighbor across the street? Not so lucky). Unfortunately, the airline went out of business due to the downturn in the economy (pity). So it is possible to internalize it.
[1] It was a charter air service. I was really looking forward to it. Even if it was more expensive than economy, it wasn't as expensive as business or first class. You did have to have very flexible travel schedule to get cheaper flights.
To start, the amount of time spent in airport varies highly by city and airport.
There's room to optimize that time — Global Entry / NEXUS and TSA Precheck for example.
Taking one of the first flights in the morning or last flights at night can also significantly reduce it.
Public charter / executive airports are another. One example is Ultimate Air Shuttle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_Air_Shuttle).
> Ultimate Air Shuttle offers various benefits to passengers that some other airlines do not. These services include no baggage fees, no cancellation fees, and the ability to arrive at the airport 15 minutes before scheduled departures.
I'm not saying charter is available and accessible for every route, but there are lots of options out there.