The US Startup Visa: A boon for dismayed, frustrated British entrepreneurs | Hacker News Reader

The US Startup Visa: A boon for dismayed, frustrated British entrepreneurs

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28 pointsmicrypt32 comments

>> "This is a critical reason why most tech startups in the UK go absolutely nowhere. You can’t legislate against it. It’s built straight into the culture."

[Citation needed]

This piece is fairly short on evidence+numbers, and overloaded with sweeping generalizations.

>> " If you’re starting a new tech business, the only place — the ONLY place — you should be is Silicon Valley."

If you need to schmooze VC/need to work for a big company for a while so you can schmooze their M&A department/etc, then probably Silicon Valley is the best bet.

But if you just want to build a tech company that makes money, it doesn't much matter where you are.

>> "That is a traffic warden putting a parking ticket on the Bugatti. That is also a crowd cheering on the traffic warden. Why? Well it’s because each of the people watching will never, ever, ever have the capacity to even think about buying an £800,000 Bugatti. They know it. They know their place. Why should someone else be allowed to be successful enough to blow almost a million quid on a car? Yeah. Fluck’em! Rich B’stards!"

They're cheering because the car is probably in the way.

Jeez what a stupid 'article'. The author just comes across as someone who has failed and is blaming it all squarely on the 'culture' rather than any fault of his own.

And FWIW, flying out for a couple of days every 3 months is hardly a big deal. If the US had universal healthcare I think it'd be more appealing.

(Caveat): I don't really care about 'the scene'. I just sit in my office, do my own thing. I don't really need a 'tech scene', I've got one online :/

You're absolutely right Axod, it was never meant to be a pinpoint piece that you'd read in The Economist with everything sourced. It's just my opinion complete with sweeping generalisations.

I've failed many times but I've also been very successful too.

They're cheering because the car is probably in the way.

In the UK, ~30-50 people do not get into a crowd and "cheer" a traffic warden doing their job unless the car belongs to someone they hate a lot more than traffic wardens.. and traffic wardens are vilified in the UK to ridiculous levels (there was a recent documentary about this - http://youtu.be/4TxxiXZHXD0).

If the US had universal healthcare I think it'd be more appealing.

Annual travel insurance is so cheap in the UK - even that covering the US - that using the US healthcare system isn't really an issue to most travellers.

Yeah maybe the traffic ticket is more about class differences.

One cultural difference is that in the UK, a lot of sitcoms are about lower/middle class people. In the US many sitcoms seem to be about insanely rich people. So perhaps that comes into play.

But in any event, the result would have been similar anywhere where supercars are a rarity.

  * Crowd gather to see supercar
  * Parking attendent give car a ticket
  * Crowd cheer/laugh/etc because it's something you don't see often.

Also there's probably a large element of people cheering, glad to see that laws are equally applied to both rich and poor.

I don't think you can just cite this as evidence that people in the UK are jealous of wealth.

Yes, the piece is definitely short on evidence and high on anecdotes, but you know there's a grain of truth to it.

In the UK if I told a random person I was starting a company, I'd be met with a blank stare or maybe I'd be told "wow, you're brave" or just "you're crazy". Actually I don't think it's much different in most of the US. But in the Bay Area, there's barely anyone I can talk to (in the 'scene' or not) who won't have a word of encouragement or a useful contact. I'm not kidding - I've talked to people who, from their lifestyles and interests, I would assume would have no connection whatsoever with startups - but almost invariably that's nearly impossible in the Bay Area.

If the US had universal healthcare I think it'd be more appealing.

I couldn't agree more. The US healthcare system is cruel, unfair, arbitrary, random, and very wasteful. If Grayson's bill passed, I would buy into Medicare in a heartbeat. I could talk all day about how shitty the current situation is ;)

I disagree. People start companies here all the time. No one thinks 'wow+brave' / 'crazy'. After all, it costs £20 to set up a Ltd company and get trading.

We're probably slightly more grounded and have a slightly lower stomach for high risk stuff, but I don't see that as necessarily a bad thing at all.

I guess one of the questions is 'can you succeed if you don't buy into the "scene" schmooze contacts culture etc'. I think you can, depending on your business model of course, but there are some fairly big success stories out there.

Also really, these days you can get a ton of contacts online. You don't have to be in any particular place.

> > "And FWIW, flying out for a couple of days every 3 months is hardly a big deal. If the US had universal healthcare I think it'd be more appealing."

Immigration will get very suspicious of you if you're spending almost all of your time in the States. The business visitor visas are supposed to be for you to conduct meetings and sales pitches, etc - not for you to actually do your day-to-day work.

Ultimately they'll just refuse entry to you.

I used to have a valid US work visa, and then I moved to Canada and let the US visa expire. Few weeks ago when I was transiting through the US I was sent to secondary screening because they assumed I was going to just stay in the States when I landed there.

US immigration has a really really hard time believing that you _wouldn't_ want to live the US, and assume that you'll do anything to stay there.

I flew back and forth from UK->US between 2004 and 2008. Probably 40 or so times. Never had an issue with immigration :/

I think they're fairly fine with it as long as you look confident and know what they want to hear.

The best part of leaving the UK was escaping the cycle of negativity. Sure this guy is warped by it and comes across really badly, but it's insanely helpful being able to say I'm working on a startup and have people be understanding and supportive. If you don't believe me about the attitude of some British people, check out this Guardian article and the comments:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/jul/10/not-safe-fo...

I tried to make sense of it all myself here:

http://petewarden.typepad.com/searchbrowser/2009/07/you-cant...

Linked to both of those in an update at the bottom of the post Pete. Nice one!

He nailed it. It's written in an abrasive tone that's sure to attract negative reactions, but the array of positive comments left so far show an undercurrent of support (and I've had plenty of positive retweets and responses on Twitter after mentioning it). Nonetheless, it's the patriotic right of some to believe everything is fine and dandy here.

I've always played it by being based in the UK (because I haven't been able to move to the US, maybe in a few years) but having 90%+ of my customer base in the US (I even took angel investment from the US, like the article's author). That way I enjoy the UK's tax system and I can live here legally, but I enjoy a customer base with a clue (try selling Internet services or advertising in the UK - ha ha ha). Works for now-ish but the startup visa could be a big help.

(In retrospect, maybe I should edit my post to say this guy is totally wrong to stop getting downvoted by the handful of patriotic Brits who remain :-) By jove, humbug to the US, chaps, the UK is splendid!)

> In the UK, entrepreneurs try too. The first thing that happens is they become social outcasts. They’re labeled, with a bit of a laugh, ‘delboys’

what is this nonsense. (If anything I find high correlation between entrepreneurs and getting laid.)

(I thought you were plc on Twitter and hence British? I'll explain anyway for the benefit of the non-Brits!)

Del Boy - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Del_Boy - is the lead character in, perhaps, Britain's best ever sitcom that ran in the early 1980s, Only Fools and Horses. Del Boy was a slightly shady trader-cum-entrepreneur who always had an eye out for some dodgy merchandise to shift.

Calling some a "Del Boy" communicates the attitude of seeing entrepreneurs as fly by nights, always looking out for an easy buck.

oh, heh, I simply meant "this doesn't actually happen" :)

Lovely Jubbly!

It's happened to me and my colleagues and their colleagues (repeat) many times. Good news for you though, if you've not experienced it!

I don't know how popular it is, but I've faced it. I now only tend to associate with people in the lifestyle or who have aspirations to work for themselves anyway.

I'm guessing it's a lot less common nowadays, though, simply because entrepreneurship and business have become "cool" thanks to the popularity of the Internet and TV shows like Dragon's Den (Shark Tank, to those of you in the US) and The Apprentice. In the last 90s, though, when I first became self employed, people did react a bit weirdly!

That's actually very accurate for certain segments of UK society

Maybe you hang around the wrong segments :/

The author’s a bit bitter, isn’t (s)he?

Yes, spent all the article going on about how negative the British are ... kind of ironic really. Then this:

"Meanwhile to all British entrepreneurs reading, your head can go back in the sand now."

Oooh! Bitchy! I wonder what it's like being the only person in the UK with an ounce of entrepreneurial talent and ambition?

He's got some points and undoubtedly the optimism the US is famous for is a bit lacking here, but you'd think he was writing about North Korea rather than a G7 nation.

I’ve worked out what annoys me about this article. It’s assuming that the point of a startup is to make you a ton of money rather than a ton of enjoyment. Sorry, but I’d go for the latter every day of the week. Maybe it’s the Britishness in me coming out :)

The thing that annoys me is the assumption that we're all anti-success narrow-minded ne'er-do-wells without the gumption to get out and be successful, or celebrate when other people are successful. And you know, I don't recognise that in most of the people I meet. Some of them, but it's not the majority.

That honestly to me seems to be a much larger problem in the London startup scene. I'm out there pretty often and it's not bad -- there are a lot of investors both VC and angel, a good smattering of startups and altogether a great environment for starting a company ... and all everybody does is complain about how bad it is.

At the last TechCrunch meetup I went to there, there was a whole talk with completely bat-shit reasons on why the UK had it so bad and the US was so much better (e.g. startups couldn't do well because Brown isn't as cool as Obama).

startups couldn't do well because Brown isn't as cool as Obama

OMG, someone used that as an excuse? What was their excuse when Blair and Bush were in power?

I know a couple Brazilian ones that are quite frustrated too.

Well, I would have said from that rant that it is pretty clear why nobody invested in his ventures or purchased his products.

I thought I better step in here to say that I've had $25k, $50k, $300k, $1,000,000 and $2,000,000 investments so far. The last exit was $24m, the products and services continue to be purchased.

Ewan (author of the post)

Good for you!

So why not mention that in the article to balance things a bit?

I wanted to target the British entrepreneurs who're suffering and keeping quiet, or not necessarily recognising reality. I didn't think think that including my achievements would necessarily be that useful. But I understand it would have helped to balance things out though.

Can the founder on this visa eventually apply for a green card, and bring their family here? Or is it employment-only visa?

I think you'll be thrown out of the country as soon as your startup tanks or you choose to leave the startup.

If I understand correctly you can get a visa if you invest $100,000 usd and employ 5 american residents. Isn't that a good fit for the start up founders?

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