Pebble 2, Time 2 + All-New Pebble Core
kickstarter.com
kickstarter.com
And I'm going to wait on this one. If they're going to delve into the fitness category, I'll be looking at Garmins (of which I have several, albeit older ones with no smart watchy stuff) which are more durable (my $DEITY, does the Pebble get scratched up), go forever on a charge, and I'm willing to bet just plain do the job better because Garmin has been at it for a while.
Given the hurdles on iOS that Pebble can't seem to overcome (for which they are not entirely, if at all, to blame), I'll also wait and see what Apple has on tap. Apple has some shortcomings to eliminate, maybe they'll do that next round.
It's not because I'm unhappy with my Pebbles, I love my current Time Steel. But if I'm going to spend money on a watch that does what Pebble is currently advertising, my options open up to include established competitors in that space. I'm not willing to bet real money that Pebble can outdo those competitors right out of the gate. So I'll wait until it hits retail, see what it really does and what the experiences of others are. Maybe I'll get one, but it's not guaranteed like it was for previous versions.
Given that they were a GPS company that people wrote off as being irrelevant in the age of smartphones and Google Maps they have done a great job carving out multiple niches in sports devices (and that ignores their "Smart Glass" airplane business).
I have 2 Edge cycling computers and a Garmin running watch and love them all.
The Edge 520 is the type of device that I'd see the specs of and expect to be a half-implemented heap of junk (connects to my phone to receive notifications while I ride? Automatically uploads rides when I finish them? This will never work). And yet it really is rather good.
They've lost physical buttons (it's much, much safer to get back to map view via tactile sensation) and added horrible drag-based panning to the overhead map view. The device can't reliably distinguish between a tap to initiate a drag and a tap to select a point. Selecting a point recenters the map. The two fight one another, usually going in the wrong direction.
It no longer supports an ad-hoc routing workflow. Before, you could select start and end points to your journey, then randomly select waypoints to visit from the map view, and they'd be added in the most sensible order. Now, if you manage to force the map view to point at where you want to go, then it forces you to select the insertion point of the new waypoint in a list, where you can't tell whether you'll be doubling back on yourself. I have to do all my routing in Google Maps now and then add villages to the route using the city finder. Ad-hoc routing by the roadside looking for curvy roads used to be a 60 second activity. Now I need to take off my gloves, pull out my phone, try and find relevant waypoints by name, type them in - it takes 10x as long.
The hardware is woefully underpowered. It feels just as slow as the Zumo 550 first released ten years ago. It can't route distances longer than about 400 miles if it doesn't involve motorways. Recalculation takes up to several minutes. Redrawing the screen in the middle of London after a zoom change can take nearly a minute.
Can't agree more! I just wish they had a decent SDK so we could have apps on Garmin devices just like Pebble OS.
She bought a Garmin Vivoactive after xmas and both of us havent looked back. We get 2-3 weeks pf battery with moderate gps use. Alerts work way better then the Pebble watch. I highly recommend the garmin. I forget I have to charge it, but it takes 2 hrs to go from 20%-100%.
Also, I only know one person who wears a pebble, and it was a hand me down. Eveyone I know who owned a Pebble switched to Appl, Android Wear, Microsoft Band or Garmin.
I agree the garmin was very sharp but mine for whatever reason lost bluetooth connection constantly.
The pebble on the other hand has been great for notifications.
I really wished the garmin had been better about that. YMMV.
What would be ideal would be a smartwatch that can manage to set Google reminders without having to have Google Now turned on; that, plus the occasional text message and even more occasional use of navigation, are all I use it for other than looking at notifications.
Just one example, it's a common and known issue that putting the 620 on the charger will sometimes drain it completely. There's magnets that hold it in place so there is no chance the proper connection wasn't made to produce a charge. Even if there wasn't any charge, it shouldn't drain it, but numerous times when I've gone to grab my watch off the charger, I've found it dead. For perspective this is a $500 top of the line watch that they offer.
When I wore a watch, I would take it off as soon as I could because it got in the way. I'm really happy with the Vivofit 2 - I haven't taken it off in (literally) months because it doesn't need to be charged and does just fine in the shower or swimming.
I've been disappointed with the automatic syncing not working. Other than that, it's a great product.
PS: my parents-in-law were given Fitbit devices with HR monitors which they had me set up for them. I'd like the HR monitoring but not at the cost of having a thicker device and having to deal with a proprietary charge connection (one end is standard USB).
For watches with these features, it needs a rechargeable battery and a very thin water-proof connection to that battery.
https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/into-sports/health-fitness/v...
Your wrist must smell great.
That says more about iOS than about Pebble. Get an Android. The experience is much better.
Don't get me wrong, Android is the clear answer here but it's still difficult to justify switching. It would be great if Apple just opened up their smartwatch functionality, but alas...
Believe it or not, I actually went that route. My Pebble experience was better, but there's a reason I'm back on iOS. In retrospect, it was incredibly stupid to change my mobile OS just to support a watch. Shoulda just bought a different watch.
The new Time 2 fixes this, from what I can see, in addition to making the display bigger (two sides of the same coin, but still worth the distinction).
Adding the HRM feature, and the fact that I love everything else about my Time Steel (the readability being the exception), I buddied up for a 2x order.
It's worth mentioning that the Pebble team have been doing some fantastic work on the OS on the past few months; the continuous updates are great.
Also I still get 9+ days from each charge with my always on display; nothing else in the smart watch market comes close.
I'm not OP, but I've had the opposite experience: I'm not using mine anymore.
I have both the original Pebble and the Pebble Time, but I've abandoned them in favor of a Suunto Ambit 3.
It functions well enough as a basic smartwatch (it can receive notifications, and that's about it) and fitness tracker, but is far better as a running watch: it records and displays more metrics, with far greater accuracy. Since it is also my fitness tracker, I'm wearing it every day instead of the Pebble, because I don't want two sets of incomplete data.
It's far more important to me to have a watch that functions as a running watch than one that has smartwatch features.
Wearing it as I type right now. But that's because all of my Garmin watches (610 and 910, IIRC) are old enough to not have the smart watch stuff. If I had a 920, I'd ditch the Pebble. I just can't yet justify the $400 simply to aggregate my wrist-worn devices.
Big handfuls, you'll get about 8 days out of it, less a day for every 30 minutes of running.
Garmin have released a few firmware updates for the watch which may account for the difference between my findings and those of early adopters.
It uses more battery life, but in a lot of cases it's the difference between accurate positioning and not.
So, yeah, I'd try doing same day runs on clear days, with GLONASS on and off, and compare drain rate.
I love that they're marketing it as hackable. I wish more companies would do that.
I wonder what kind of interface the expansion port is.
Pebble is so underrated. I've tried out so many smartwatches and activity trackers and always come back to the Pebble Time. It just keeps getting better and better! Kudos!
Could be a great pairing.
Well there aren't any pictures of the bottom, or very good pictures of any of the sides either. I would guess it has a similar sim tray on one of the sides as many phones do.
I don't care about Core for running, I just need the hackable version
I don't know much about the pager protocol, but I think it doesn't require transmit power on the endpoint. I'm imagining a mode where the Pebble goes out of range of the Core, and then goes into passive pager mode maybe with some kind of SMS to pager gateway.
I love the fact that the Pebble is such a focused device; I'd never trade it for an "screen on demand when shaking it around" iWatch, even if they threw an iPhone in for free.
I currently have an original Pebble Steel. I pre-ordered a Time 2 today, but I'd love to be able to upgrade my order to a Round 2. That watch is, by far, the nicest looking smartwatch so far, from any manufacturer.
Backing a Kickstarter is not "pre-ordering". Kickstarter is not a store. Maybe you feel more confident because this is Pebble, but the distinction remains. Buying something from Kickstarter is not placing an order for something. It's investing in an idea.
There are significant differences between a pre-order and backing. There are accounting differences for Kickstarter and there are less guarantees for backers than for pre-orders. You aren't entitled to any of your money back, support, or timeliness. Pebble Time showed up at Best Buys before backers got their watches. I bought my Pebble Time from the pebble website and people were still complaining about having backed the kickstarter.
With a kickstarter you're shooting your money into the void and hope something comes back to you. With a pre-order you're legally entitled to a product or your money back and receive benefits from the various federal and state laws that govern how businesses do commerce.
Fair point about timeliness, but where did you get the idea that you're not entitled to your money back or support? From the Kickstarter page:
> We stand firmly behind our products. Each Pebble product includes with a 30 day (after you receive it) money back guarantee and minimum 1 year limited warranty.
I'm also sure he doesn't need us to tell him the differences between kickstarter order and a true pre-order.
I just went on a 6 day vacation and didn't even bring my charger. Worked like a champ.
My lower button does start to feel a bit mushy... It still clicks but not as nice as the upper one. If it stays like this, no problem, I'm just a bit afraid I will stop working exactly after the warranty runs out, and I can't see how I would be able to fix that myself. I'm hoping to get at least 4 years of usage out of this watch.
What apps do you use and can recommend?
I treat it as a secretary. I think of different communication media as having different urgencies / time constants. Emails are a daily report. My phone's notifications are an hourly report. Notifications which I forward to my watch are the instant things. Be sure to mercilessly "mute" most apps from bugging you on your wrist. With this setup, I never feel the urge to check my phone. If there is something important, it would've buzzed my wrist.
Here are my subjectively appreciated apps
Homescreen: Fairweather. It is information dense display of weather, sunset time, pressure, vis., etc.
(Top) Button shortcut: Forecast weather. Shows a probability of precipitation over the next 24hrs (I donated for data from forecast.io). Great for avoiding the rain when walking the dog / biking home / etc.
(Bottom) Button shortcut: A bus/train stop info panel. It uses the phone's GPS to tell you when the next buses/trains are coming. Handy for when there is a stop within 100 feet of the bar and you can know if you want that extra beer or not.
Timer/Multitimer are great. Alarms for waking up are great. 7minute workout app is great.
- Compass - for compass and the ultra-cool switching between normal and "in-flight HUD" display depending on your wrist orientation.
- GPS Bookmark - lets you bookmark the location you're standing in right now, and later display the direction and the distance to that location. It uses the compass on your watch and your phone's GPS. It works on GPS coordinates, so it doesn't require you to have any Internet connection. I found it extremely useful when I was in Shenzhen, China - I bookmarked my hotel and work, and used the third bookmark slot (you have one slot per button) to record temporary locations like the metro station I just got off from. It was really invaluable for finding my way back from wherever I ended up going.
- PebbleTasker - like the name suggests, it lets you call Tasker tasks to Pebble. I.e. you can make Pebble buttons do pretty much anything on your phone, without having to write an app yourself. You can bind some to each button, and then also use a list menu for more. The bindings can also be dynamically configurable from within Tasker, if you feel like making e.g. location-aware actions on your watch, or something.
- AutoPebble from AutoApps plugins for Tasker - something similar to PebbleTasker, but more advanced - you can dynamically configure the contents and behaviour of the watchapp from Tasker. A bit more difficult to set up, but also much more powerful. It's probably the best option if you want to have whatever the data you want on your watch, and in the way you want it.
2. Kickstarter money is technically a donation, so you can spend the money right away if you need to. (taking a typical pre-order is little tricky from an accounting perspective if it's considered revenue)
Edit: renamed 'Prepaid' to 'Unearned' -- had to brush up on my GAAP nomenclature
Says who? Here's what the terms of use say:
As a project, I'd be unlikely to offer a complicated physical device that I was not yet able to produce. I might put weaselly bullshit about a reward being a great sticker and up to 1 device.
It's certainly not portrayed as a pure donation (money given with no specific reciprocal commitment) in Kickstarter's terms.
Edit: Other comments referencing marketing make a good point. PR value is big for a massively successful kickstarter.
I went in on the Pebble Steel in the past, and while I expected a Duty charge, I didn't expect it to be around 100$ Canadian.
EDIT: Sorry I meant Pebble Time Steel
On a side note Canadian shoppers can find the watches at their local Best Buy... at least the current ones anyway. You might not get the style you want though, as they seem to be a bit limited that way. Pricing is usually close to the US price. I paid the extra to get the style I wanted for the wife.
It was a bit of a farce, they should just have shipped directly from HK or wherever; I sorted myself out by reverting to standard postage.
And they have filled order books which will help to raise money if there is a need for it.
Pebble 2 and Time 2 is nearly complete. We’re currently ramping up at our factory and are ready to meet the estimated delivery times.I'm intrigued with the Pebble 2 and Time 2 - like that it's always on, and can go a long time between charges. But how does it work with iOS? From The Wirecutter, it looks like it's not a pleasant experience http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-smartwatch-iphone/#peb... Any other opinions?
Looking fwd to the Pebble2 though. IMO all smartwatches should be eInk and hackable.
It's more expensive but well worth the extra money IMHO.
Garmin does a nice job bridging the cap between the "smart" watches like Pebble and the Apple watch, and the more serious fitness devices like those from Polar and Suunto.
I have much "nicer" watches, but this one is just far more utilitarian, especially for an active person.
It's also very sharp looking in comparison to the cheaper/plastic looking option.
That said, software could be improved, and that's an understatement. The mess that is "basecamp" is a disgrace, esp. for a company like Garmin which is associated with navigation...
Based on the cost of the Forerunner, if the new Pebble Time 2 is as accurate or better, the cost alone might have me buying it. That said I'm on Android so I would get all the benefits unlike the iOS crowd.
I think that a lot of people will buy if Pebble can price this competitively. Their closest competition is the $250 TomTom Spark Cardio + Music, and it seems like they will undercut that. With that said, 6 months is a long time, and I wouldn't be surprised if new and better devices come out before this ships.
> You can also use Core’s 4GB of built-in storage to access your favorite playlists, podcasts, and audiobooks.
> Core also works without a SIM card or cellular plan, using WiFi to sync offline music and workouts.
Another useful use case would be an emergency button for elderly people. Current devices are rather expensive and/or only work at home.
I didn't find Germany's mobile internet too expensive, I was quite happy with Congstar prepaid when I was last over there. Certainly comparable with Australian mobile internet pricing. On the other hand, Australia now has free mobile Spotify streaming (on Optus), not sure if Congstar does.
Oops, now I see what exactly the core is... Maybe a bit different.
Besides that they say the Core runs "unlocked" Android 5.0, so I'd imagine you can load it up with whatever you like.
I wish Eric & the rest of Pebble the best of luck-- they really are one of only three viable smartwatch platforms, which is pretty incredible for such a small company. It'll be interesting to see how they can fit the core into the activity monitor space as well.
I wonder whether Google Project Fi will support this. Fi is already very reasonably priced and recently began offering data-only SIM cards extending a base plan with a pay-as-you-go rate.
Just today I opened a support call to figure out what data they transmit to their servers and how long they store it.
I'm also currently unconvinced that you can use the Pebble to track steps/your sleep without uploading your data (i.e. it seems that you either opt into Pebble Health and Pebble gets your data or .. you don't get it either).
Depending on the reaction of the support call I will either dispose of this thing or use it offline - new products from Pebble aren't exactly interesting for me at this point..
You even got a reply on this random board from another pebble customer who's still confused (and usage log doesn't seem likely to me, that sounds like telemetry? "User likes to access feature A" vs "All the sensor data").
In short: I'm looking forward to the support reply. Initial reply was 'forwarding to tech, might need more time'. Please consider making this more explicit, if you're in a position to bring this issue up.
Edit: In fact, this comment of yours convinced me that Pebble (vs all the other watches) IS the right choice - I just backed the campaign for a Time 2 / Core combo). Thanks.
Personally, if it were an option, I would like to disable sending health data but still send voice data for transcription. I can understand if you're using Google's voice recognition APIs, but IMO there's no reason the two have to be linked.
- The heartrate reader is only accurate when you're at rest. Any sort of sweat or physical activity and the reading becomes wildly inaccurate or just stops working.
- The app takes like 5-10 minutes to sync every time and it won't sync in the background. So when syncing, I have to move my finger around on the phone so my phone doesn't lock and mess up the sync. I live in China so that might be the issue here. YMMV
- It does auto detect but I have a Vespa scooter so everytime I ride my scooter, it counts it as me walking a shitton of steps and I have to manually go on the website to delete those activities. This is also occasionally an issue in cars.
Overall, just dissatisfied with how this product works.
I'm OK with the HR accuracy, but the sync issues make it more trouble than it's worth. I still wear the thing, but only bother to sync and look at the app perhaps once a week at most since it's so damn slow.
Mine has an air bubble in it (which is common, just do a search) while many others have also reported that their charge band is peeling.
You make it sound like those desires are at odds, when in fact a smartwatch supports your goal. Thanks to my Pebble, I only take my phone out of my pocket when I intend to use it. I don't even take my phone out of my pocket to reply to text messages sometimes now, since I can do it from my Pebble. Ditto for changing/pausing the song on Spotify, or of course checking the time, which I used to use my phone for before I got my Pebble (first first gen, then Time). Not to mention it's great to be able to send calls to voicemail if I don't want to answer them or don't recognize the number, and I can do that without stopping walking.
I'm sure I'd frequently fire up Twitter or Hacker News if I had my phone in my hands after replying to a text, so I think my Pebble saves me from a lot of distractions.
Fortunately, there isn't enough screen real estate and input methods to get a lot of gaming going.
If the pebble would do 3G an I could answer calls? I think I'd even hardly ever use my phone anymore.
Also would be great to see it tie into other devices like cadence / speed sensors for bike rides.
Does show that these types of devices are just around the corner, which is exciting. For me, I'll keep on trucking my phone with me until I get full integration with tracking heart rate and cycling metrics.
Core can take your Pebble watch to the next level. When paired, Core provides a network connection for internet-enabled Pebble apps. "
Hopefully this won't fragment the app marketplace and it will maintain universal app coverage across all the Pebble watches.
I wonder if it would be possible for an Android Wear watch to do something similar to the Pebble: Long battery life, no touch screen, e-paper display and run alright. I imagine the colour space differences between e-paper and LCD would cause issues though.
Most Android apps require more system resources than the entirety of a Pebble watch.
Aside, I'm continually impressed with Pebble, and disappointed with Android Wear products. Taking a phone OS and cramming it on a watch seems lazy, not innovative, and the experience has never felt great. What Pebble has done feels really innovative and polished -- they've come a long way.
"$79 or more Limited (14991 of 15000 remaining) ONE Pebble Core in your choice of white or black."
Add to that the fact that it requires its own 3g connection, which will add a monthly cost. I'd much rather have built-in storage sufficient to store audiobooks and podcasts...
> You can also use Core’s 4GB of built-in storage to access your favorite playlists, podcasts, and audiobooks.
Not sure if it will work with Audible specifically, but it should work with normal audiobook files.
You do not have to have a 3G connection to use it. It has WiFi for offline syncing.
The Bragi Dash has no GPS... just accelerometer tracking as far as I can tell.
I had one for a few days, it has GPS and internal storage. I passed on it because of the backlit LCD screen, replacing it with a watch that has an OLED screen but no GPS -- but then I cycle, and always have my phone with me.
I think the Core is really interesting but his hopeful "instead of" vision might be naive, based on the Core's capabilities.
Leaving a smartphone at home when it only weighs as much as a gulp of water (e.g. a 4 oz iPhone) seems like a step 20 years backwards in convenience and peace of mind when you can't call or message from a Core.
I have never in my life taken my phone with me on a jog, and I would never want to. I put my Fitbit Charge HR in exercise mode, and if I want music (which I usually don't), I'll take an iPod shuffle. Connectivity to the wider world web is not on my agenda, and something like the Core is likely the extent of technology that I'd want on my person.
It's the coolest product I've seen lately in the fitness sphere.
...on a side note, one of the reasons I enjoy jogging without music is that it gives me a chance to let my thoughts flow, and I find myself coming up with all sorts of neat ideas while my heart rate is high and I'm out and about with zero distractions. I've long wanted a voice memo recorder while out on a run, and the fact that the Core includes that makes it even more enticing!
Meanwhile, my Garmin 810 sits on the bike and can go 12+ hours with GPS and display on. It has hardware buttons for the important stuff and a touchscreen that still works in the rain with a zero chance of ending up in some freaking "Google now" screen accidentally.
Looking at the back, it appears so. I think they've sort of backed off on the Smart Strap strategy after nothing has really materialized out of it.
Still, I imagine it leaves a sour taste in the mouth of anyone else looking at making "Smart Straps".
Edit: Also interesting, the new Time 2 has an MSRP $50 cheaper than the Time Steel.
Wish they kept the leather strap, though, but maybe they will have different straps available down the road?
Anyway, I love Pebble, I like their approach with always-on e-paper-like screens. I do am however a bit disappointed they jumped completely on the fitness bandwagon. Is there nothing more interesting to do with wearables than sports?
Are you anticipating major delays? January isn't very deep.
But, even if they ship in January that is still a long ways away, and plenty of changes and new products will be launched before (in my opinion, that's the real risk with these long announcement/pay times for this kind of presale).
Anyway I'm not surprised they'd go back to kickstarter. Tons of promotion and I bet they get a special rate compared to most other users of kickstarter.
Doesn't exactly inspire confidence if a company doesn't stand behind its products. Even Google does a better job.
I upgraded to a Time not that long ago and it's been solid. I haven't heard of a whole lot of problems with anything but the originals.
That being said, it almost feels like an abuse of the platform. It's their third generation of smartwatches after all. I really like the new models with heart monitor though and now they've also added a pure fitness tracker-like device.
Everyone called me crazy for wanting to do it, but it looks like that market actually exists - without a screen, even.
There's one absurdly overpriced smart band on the market currently and it doesn't function well. Right now if I want one I'll need to build it myself :/
Not sure there is enough value in supporting it, compared to the outlay on development.
Personally I don't get the 'not enough value in supporting it' considering the other phone systems obviously had to gain support at some point - now, more than ever considering the universal platform, Windows development makes a lot of sense.
Still, it's their choice - I'll just spend my money elsewhere.
The core is apparently a smartphone without the touch screen, or perhaps a mobile router with extra smarts.
Anyways, i am really not a fan of this timeline thing they have been going with on their recent watch models.
Does that mean that they don't have to pay sales tax on any of these preorders?