Introducing the HP Jet Fusion 3D Printing Solution | Hacker News Reader

Introducing the HP Jet Fusion 3D Printing Solution

h20435.www2.hp.com

44 pointsprotomyth36 comments

A slightly more informative video about how it works: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeTdo-w6Qx8

Edit: And another much more informative video about the actual printing process: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXntl3ff5tc

Looks like it uses black ink printing onto plastic beads spread on a printing bed to make some sections melt under light and others not.

Edit2: Probably not actually "black" but "UV Absorbing" for the ink.

the contained waste material recovery is a nice touch :) now, where did I put my piggy bank...

It almost certainly uses black ink. All parts produced with the machine they have now are to be black. It technically doesn't use beads, it uses plastic powder. It works exactly as you described though.

Oh, yeah. I put the UV part in there because of the talk about full color printing. The first time through that video I missed the key phrase "could in the future"[1].

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXntl3ff5tc&t=3m27s

Why would you need UV absorption for color printing?

Well, I'd assume white counts as a color, as well as other light colors. Plus they then go on to talk about printing clear things. You need to absorb energy from somewhere so I figured UV was about all that was left.

Fyi: The printer is $130,000.

I'm not saying it isn't great, but it's not exactly for home use. Or if it IS for your home, you have an amazing home, can I please come live with you and use your printer?

I've often thought that a new version of the Copy Shop (e.g. Kinkos) would probably be a better start for mass 3D printing because the machine could be much better than the home model and people really don't need to use it that frequently yet. $130,000 might be good enough for that use.

A rapid prototype version of Kinkos. I love the idea, I wonder how much copies would have to cost to make it economical to buy something like this.

More likely a machine shop would expand their capability by adding one of these.

I've seen multiple UPS Stores with 3D printers on-site. (Granted I do live in the SF Bay Area.)

Agreed - and I think it will stay that way. Right now most people find it too much expense and trouble to keep a photo-quality color (2D) inkjet at home, and would rather pay per-photo at Kinkos/Walgreens. I don't see any signs of this changing.

I think 3D printers will go the same way. How many little plastic parts does the average consumer ever want to print? Probably not enough, and not rapidly enough, to justify a big purchase, when they can pay per-item at a (physical or online) Kinkos equivalent and get a higher-quality part printed on a machine like this.

Are you paying for the resolution or the new tech?

"Insert the pre-packed HP 3D Materials cartridges into the HP Jet Fusion 3D Processing Station." Will the use of 3rd party materials cartridges void my HP Jet Fusion 3D Processing station warranty? ;)

Probably. I doubt you'll be seeing third-party budget materials any time soon.

The printer looks interesting, but the PR is kind of insane. I'd really like to know some basic specs - speed, max object size, and so on - but I can't find them easily under the tsunami of marketing awesome.

You're not the target audience :).

Welcome to the XXI century - when companies finally figured that marketing has a much better ROI than producing anything of substance. I wonder if in the limit we'll hit a future when people will be selling each other stories and dreams, not bothering with actual products or services anymore? :).

>I wonder if in the limit we'll hit a future when people will be selling each other stories and dreams, not bothering with actual products or services anymore? :).

I think they call that "Kickstarter".

Supposedly they are making the materials it can use 'open,' meaning that you might be able to refill it with your own powder. The interesting thing is, they have to do this because of the market they are targeting.

HP is targeting the service bureau market with this machine. Services bureaus are companies that 3d print parts for people. Service bureaus really like to run a wide variety of different materials. Like special high strength blends, flexible, lost wax casting blends, and special fireproof materials for airplanes. Running different materials lets service bureaus differentiate themselves from other service bureaus. In addition, certain markets like lost wax casting and aerospace have to use certain special materials.

Although what HP might end up doing is selling ink or inkjet heads. This machine literally works by spraying black ink down where one wants part.

please drink a verification can: http://i.imgur.com/dgGvgKF.png

In the mean time Carbon (http://carbon3d.com/) has also 'reinvented' 3D printing but can show a working model: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2thSsQrZUM

I think Carbon will change 3D printing because they provide better chemical / structural (layer less) properties and better speed so it is more suitable for production models.

There are now several startups claiming to have "fast" photopolymer printing technologies. However Carbon is more about the materials R&D than the machine, it was merely a tool. CLIP is the most legitimized with press, funding, customers, and IP. (I just met the Carbon folks today to see their machines)

Can someone familiar with the space speak to how much of this is advertising and how much is genuine progress/innovation?

I am currently at the Rapid conference in Orlando where the HP announcement was made. When the technology was first announced last year I'm pretty sure they were the only ones using this kind of process. There are a few different powder/binder/inkjet type machines out there now but I don't think anyone is doing fusion in the same way.

The entire discipline of additive manufacturing is rapidly expanding with new processes and applications.

The hype is real and I really hope HP doesn't fuck this up. HP seems to have invented a new additive manufacturing process(if you have prior art let me know!) that does the same thing as laser sintering except without a laser. Getting rid of the laser is a pretty big deal. Lasers are expensive and expensive to operate because they are inefficient. Because they're inefficient you need to cool them.

Laser sintering is also slow because you have to scan a dot all over the place. You could make this faster, except now you need more lasers. Transitioning from a dot scan, a laser, to a line scan, a big wide inkjet, is where they are getting such a speed improvement.

They also seem to have removed the need for an inert gas purge system, which laser sintering machines must use(although I'm not 100% sure this is the case).

In all likelihood, they have probably made laser sintering obsolete and service bureaus are probably scrambling to buy these machines as we speak.

But, thing is they didn't just stop at making laser sintering obsolete. Because they can print strong parts in color they have probably made some other additive manufacturing processes obsolete too. Z-corp's 3d printing(what the phrase '3d printing actually refers to') which makes parts in color with about the structural capacity of chocolate.

Theres a video explaining the print process

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXntl3ff5tc

Is this even real? I didn't even see any printing take place.

Sure real. Printing is demoed within the first video where you see laser beams working on a powder bed.

Yes I saw it hours ago in person

Funny, was there footage of actual 3D printing taking place?

Kinda, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjpN_jobblk&t=50

Judging from the more informative videos linked in other comments, there is a brief timelapse shot of the printing. But I agree that with all the other CGI it is hard to trust it is a real timelapse shot.

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Who is the target market for this kind of printer?

Shapeways just announced they got one.

Service bureaus. Companies that 3d print parts for people. Imagine a data center, except instead of servers you have row after row of 3d printers.

HP PageWide in 3d. The 2d printers are really nice, and don't suck down power like lasers.

These look like production presses but for 3d parts

But will they Carlie Fiorina you on the ink? History says yes.

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