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Comment by MadManE | Hacker News Reader

I live in Denver, and I hate the legalization. To be clear, I have nothing against people using drugs, and in an ideal state all drugs would be legal. But now, that's all that Colorado is: one big haze of pot smoke. I can't get away from the smell anywhere. Every time I leave and come back, I have a mild allergic reaction to the smoke, and have to live with perpetual congestion.

If I could get away from the effects of other people smoking, then I would be a huge supporter. But as it stands, we might as well be back when smoking cigarettes everywhere was commonplace.

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I live in Denver too and bike around absolutely everywhere. In a 3-4 mile ride on a Friday or Saturday night, I probably smell weed 1-2x. Riding through 'liberal' neighborhoods like Rino, Cap Hill, or South Broadway are no different.

I smoke, and I'm actually always pretty surprised by just how few people do smoke here. There is a group of the jam band follower types who go at it pretty hard but even in bars where there is a lot of them (Sancho's) you really don't smell it that much.

Living in Denver myself, I have more issue avoiding cigarette smoke than I do people actually smoking weed outside (illegally, I might add)--where are you in the city that you have allergic reactions every time you leave your place?

I understand that it's illegal to smoke outdoors. But in the same way that it's illegal to speed on the highway - nobody really cares until they need to meet a ticket quota.

The largest part of the problem is my apartment complex. The ratio of stoners to non is pretty high, so the smoke just soaks into everything. I live near Glendale, but it's the same everywhere I go. I'm aggressively trying to find a new job outside of the state.

Another minor issue is the smell of the grow (ware)houses. There's about a 5 mile stretch on 25 that reeks of them on my way to and from work every day. Same on the east side of 70.

Sure, the tax money is nice for some people. But I see zero benefit from it, and a lot of annoyances.

If you have breathing problems, getting out of Denver would probably be a good start. Air quality is pretty good for a city, but you're still surrounded by motor vehicle pollution pretty much all the time.

The wildfires are probably the biggest issue with living in Colorado period though - as with many of the western states. Getting just beyond the state boundaries won't help there - you'll want to move somewhere less arid.

> The largest part of the problem is my apartment complex. The ratio of stoners to non is pretty high, so the smoke just soaks into everything.

Gotcha! Yea, that sucks. You might talk to your landlord about it or ask your neighbors to be more considerate/seal their apartments better. I live in one myself and have similar gripes. Even as a regular smoker of weed, it's gross as hell to smell smoke all the time. I also agree on the statement on 25, they could really move the grow house.... like anywhere else.

> I'm aggressively trying to find a new job outside of the state.

This seems eager for a problem that seems unique to apartment complexes; even having outside entrances to the apartments helps a lot.

However, have you checked out duplexes/houses? It's actually quite easy to find renters who are looking for non-smokers—not just in the fulfilling the lease kind of way. There are plenty of families in the city who will have similar (or stronger) reactions, and many people just don't like being around smoke.

I guess I'm surprised you find this problem dominates your experience of the city; I have more issues trying to find a way to socialize without drinking, something objectively FAR more harmful than smoking (let alone any of the other even healthier ways to intake) weed.

>It's actually quite easy to find renters who are looking for non-smokers

Sure, I can find exactly the place I want to live - as long as I'm willing to pony up the cash.

>drinking, something objectively FAR more harmful than smoking ... weed

This is a weird argument to me. I'm making statements about how other people using affects me, and this is talking about how my using affects me.

> Sure, I can find exactly the place I want to live - as long as I'm willing to pony up the cash.

So—it's not really Denver, it's cheap housing complexes in Denver. Furthermore, I know for a fact that there's plenty of affordable housing over in e.g. Lowry with family living (read: no centralized air, outside entrances, reliable utility costs), so I can't imagine this is your only option.

> This is a weird argument to me. I'm making statements about how other people using affects me, and this is talking about how my using affects me.

I'm not trying to address your needs, I'm simply pointing out that on the list of all the unhealthy things about denver, weed smoke has got to be behind social attitudes toward drinking, smoking, the high altitude, the high density of cars/people, and high rent on the public transit lines. Realistically, you could easily avoid weed smoke if you wanted to, and I frankly don't buy that it would be more expensive. There's a reason the non-smoking clauses are in all the leases—it's a liability and depreciates your property.

We must have wildly different definitions of "cheap". My rent is going up 21% in a month. My actual cheapest option is to move out of the city and get a job that pays 10-15% less.

>I'm not trying to address your needs Changing the frame of the debate doesn't change the points made. In the case of alcohol, an individual is in control of how it affects them. In the case of smoke (pot or cigarette), the individual is at the mercy of the general populace.

Lowry is out of the city; I'm not sure where we disagree.

Technically, yes, Lowry is not Denver proper. Nitpicking aside, there is no practical difference.

I should have been clearer and said "leave the metro area".

So—to be clear—you're arguing that because weed is the largest problem in spite of the fact that you cannot choose where to live? It seems like the weed problem is a symptom of generally inflating rent in the metro area. Either you can afford to live in the metro area, and you choose a healthy place to rent/own, or you can't, and you're instead complaining about a symptom of being forced to live in a place you don't like.

>The ratio of stoners to non is pretty high, so the smoke just soaks into everything.

I live in an apartment, too.

I could complain about the fact that my neighbors smoke tobacco in their apartments and that it slowly but surely seeps into mine. But I don't. I put weather stripping on my door that faces the hallway and have my windows opened slightly whenever it's warm enough to allow for it.

You have to make compromises when you live in a building shared by 400 other people.

You're part of a community. Learn to live in it.

I have to ask where you live in Denver. I smell smoke occasionally, typically walking down Colfax at night, or in LoDo, or at a concert.

What I do notice is the smell from the big dispensary/grow house on I-70 & Grape. That's not smoke, that's just the plants. I'd find that a little annoying if I lived downwind. But on the other hand, the smell from the Purina plant or the Suncor refinery or the feedlots in Greeley is way more obnoxious.

I'll pile on. I'm currently sitting on 13th/Penn in lower Capitol Hill. If there is a spot in Denver that should be covered in smoke, this is it. I smell nothing.

I live very close. Every now and then my neighbor smokes on his back porch. I can count the number of times on one hand I've smelt pot from my back yard.

Walking around the city, which I frequently do, I very rarely see people consuming pot. Occasionally from an alley on 16th and that's about it.

I live in Denver (80219 / Mar Lee) and I haven't noticed it, and I'm incredibly sensitive to smoke of all kinds.

What neighborhood are you in? What sort of building? Do you have particularly inconsiderate neighbors? How much did it change for you relative to prior to the recreational legalization, or prior to the medicinal legalization?

The change was very drastic between pre-legalization and a year after. It was already medically legal when I moved here, and I didn't notice it at all, except of course right around the dispensaries.

I do find it funny that everyone here is jumping to find excuses for why it's not that big of a deal. I'm providing my experience, and my opinion on it. It's not all happiness and sunshine.

I'm not even saying that it should be illegal again. I'm not realizing any benefit from it, so I'm leaving. Why am I being downvoted for it?

I'm guessing it was this part:

"that's all that Colorado is: one big haze of pot smoke"

As a CO resident of over 20 years, I have not noticed any change at all. The only outside consumption I've seen is in people's private yards, just like when I was an undergrad at CU in the 90s.

My neighbor warming up his diesel truck in the morning is far more nauseating.

You're probably right. It's a little over the top editorializing, but it's making the point.

I travel quite a bit, so when I come back it's a very stark difference for me. My wild guess is that it's the boiling frog situation: it's a slow change, but it effects a big difference over time.

On a side note, pot is the #1 thing that people want to talk about when I tell them where I'm from. In their eyes, CO == pot.

I agree, this is annoying:

> On a side note, pot is the #1 thing that people want to talk about when I tell them where I'm from. In their eyes, CO == pot.

OTOH, it beats talking about that guy shooting up the abortion clinic and seems to have mostly supplanted memories of Columbine or New Life Church... So it could be worse (and for a while was).

At least for a little bit we can all talk about Peyton and whether bud light is really any better than coors.

> On a side note, pot is the #1 thing that people want to talk about when I tell them where I'm from. In their eyes, CO == pot.

Haha, i sympathise: i lived near Amsterdam for many years (i'm a non-smoker), and almost anyone non-Dutch i ever met outside of the Netherlands would immediately mime smoking when it became clear where i lived. Conversely, this was usually relatively strongly negatively correlated with how cool i was likely to find the person in general, so i tried to see it as a useful people-filter :p.

> "I do find it funny that everyone here is jumping to find excuses for why it's not that big of a deal"

Nah -- just trying to figure out why your experience is so drastically different from ours. You're like "weed EVERYWHERE, it dominates EVERYTHING" and I'm confused because it hasn't impacted my day-to-day existence in the slightest. My grandpa (born in Denver in 1921) hasn't noticed it and he lives across from Kepner middle school. I guess that one stretch of globeville by the Purina plant (I-70 and York) smells terrible, but it's not worse than it always has been, just different (dog food and weed are both stinky.)

But I live in a single-family home with a yard in a low-income neighborhood, rather than an apartment building in a low-income neighborhood, so the airflow from my stoner neighbors 2 houses down is insignificant. On the other hand, my little sister lived in an apartment just south of Glendale before legalization, and she always complained about her stoner neighbors.

So you're saying my experience is unique by providing your sister's experience that is the same?

my sister's experience was pre-legalization. (Please don't be snarky.)

Your experience seems to be unique in this thread, in that you say things got substantially worse as a result of legalization. I'm just trying to make sense of it in light of everything else I know of -- my own experience and those of my family and friends and others commenting here.

I notice a slight change in the type of funk in the air near the Purina plant, but no change in the general public. The complaint that "some stoner in my apartment is making it hard to breathe" is an old one. Did your complex have a sudden influx of stoners? Did they come from out of state because of legalization? Is there something particular about your complex that makes it attractive to people who are coming for the weed? Is there something particular about my neighborhood that makes it unattractive to people who are coming for the weed? I just don't know how to build a pattern with your experience as one data point and all these other experiences as the rest of the data.

They should pass a law mandating air filters for grow houses if the smell is that bad. I see no reason why they shouldn't be regulated like any industrial operation. And since smoking outside is illegal, cops should actually ticket those who do it. Legalization is good policy, but it should be enforced consistently and properly regulated.

I agree 100%. This is not an insurmountable problem. But we have so many fanatical supporters of marijuana that no laws can be passed that would possibly limit its use.

That's not a surprise since it is one of the few and first places where it is allowed. Once the new wears off, and once detractors stop attempts to re-criminalize, I would expect more willingness to compromise from supporters.

It's agriculture, sometimes it stinks. I'd trade a dozen cannabis farms for the plastic pipe plant in my town, or the local egg farm. Same for mushrooms, corn or other grain processing, a feedlot, good grief they all stink.

I work in downtown Denver and nearly everyday I come across someone who is smoking it on the streets.

I have been to night clubs in Denver where people were asked to stop smoking a cigarette but when it came to smoking marijuana nobody cared.

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