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Comment by klunger | Hacker News Reader

I am an American in Norway...

I thought you only had to file FATCA for bank accounts that had more than $10,000 USD in them at some point in the past year. Not a few hundred. Are you sure about that? (if so, oh sh*t)

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FBAR requires you to report an account held overseas in excess of $10,000. This is separate from the reporting you do on your tax return and separate from the reporting institutions are required to do for FATCA.

FBAR is more insidious for the individual because any US taxpayer (not just citizens) is required to file an FBAR and $10,000 is a stupidly low number. Worse even if the money overseas isn't yours (in the case you have say signature authority over an account because of power of attorney) you still have to file. Even worse once one account tops $10,000 you have to report all of them even if they have zero balance. It's also not clear what constitutes an account. Example does a PayPal account count ?

The only conclusion I can come up with is that FBAR is basically there to make it easy for the Feds to do a Martha Stewart and get you for lying, because proving tax evasion is a bit hard.

(Disclaimer: Not an accountant. Consult an accountant for tax related advice)

It's a bit more complicated than that. Right now, you have to file for every bank account you own (or have signature authority for) if the combined worth is more than $10,000. So it's not as bad as I wrote at first, and I appoligise for that, I had forgotten about that factor. But it still surprises people.

Edit:

Oh, and the worth is calculated as the maximum value during the year. So if you get a contract filled for $10 000 and someone wires you the money, even if you imediately pay the rent and therefore have no money in the account, you still have to report the account.

From https://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Corporations/FATCA-Informatio...

Taxpayers with a total value of specified foreign financial assets below a certain threshold do not have to file Form 8938

From https://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Corporations/Do-I-need-to-fil...

You must file Form 8938 if: 1. You are a specified individual. tick! 2. You have an interest in specified foreign financial assets required to be reported. tick! 3. The aggregate value of your specified foreign financial assets is more than the reporting thresholds that applies to you: If you are a taxpayer living abroad you must file if: You are filing a return other than a joint return and the total value of your specified foreign assets is more than $200,000 on the last day of the tax year or more than $300,000 at any time during the year

For once, the IRS pages on this topic seems pretty clear.

Not sure if you are aware of this or not but Form 8938 is different from FBAR. FBAR is filed with the department of the treasury and the threshold is only $10,000.

Yes, form 8938 is for FATCA. I'm addressing the parent comment regarding filing for FATCA. I guess the parent had FBAR and FATCA confused.

Oh, you are right. I was mixing up FATCA and FBAR.

I think you need to report in any case, the $10,000 might be a threshold below which the bank does not inform you to the USA. The real threshold below which the bank needs to look at you is $50,000, or if you have stocks, funds, or investment-grade products, such as some insurances, $0, but some banks are using a lower threshold. Also do note that this is for preexisting accounts - new accounts need to be looked at and can end up being reported irrespective of the amount they hold.

You have to fail FACTA regardless if you hold an overseas account. If you hold less than $10k USD than it's a few check boxes and takes less than 10 minutes

Nope. You must file FBAR for all of your accounts only if the sum of them ever exceeded US$10,000 during the year. That requirement has been around for many years.

The IRS rules concerning FBAR are here: https://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-Businesses-&-Self-Emplo...

And the pertinent text from that page: "Who Must File an FBAR United States persons are required to file an FBAR if: 1. the United States person had a financial interest in or signature authority over at least one financial account located outside of the United States; and 2. the aggregate value of all foreign financial accounts exceeded $10,000 at any time during the calendar year reported."

FATCA is a new burden on foreign financial institutions that requires them to report to the US government on US citizens who have accounts at their institutions. It's meant banks in several countries have refused services to US citizens and closed their accounts.

This is only if you are self-employed or a small business owner, correct? If you are an American living abroad and working for a company does FBAR apply to you?

Any United States person has to file if they have more than $10,000 held in a overseas account.

A United States person is defined as:

"United States person includes U.S. citizens; U.S. residents; entities, including but not limited to, corporations, partnerships, or limited liability companies, created or organized in the United States or under the laws of the United States; and trusts or estates formed under the laws of the United States."

(There are exemptions for very specific circumstances)

A lot of United States persons living overseas are unaware that they need to file, and a lot of permanent residents or H-1Bs in the US are unaware that they also need to file if they still have assets held overseas. They have ramped enforcement up over the last few years so a lot of people are out of compliance and don't realize it. Thankfully at least at the

See:

http://business.financialpost.com/personal-finance/taxes/unc...

(Disclaimer: Not an accountant. Consult an accountant for tax related advice)

At least part of the complication is that overseas equivalents of 401k funds that may be mandatory to contribute to are often considered to be bank accounts by the IRS.

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