Dan | Hacker News Reader

Dan

blog.dislocatedday.com

508 pointsswombat34 comments

The timing of this is eerily appropriate for me. Some of you may be aware that Andrew Lange, a professor of physics at Caltech, committed suicide last week. (His NY Times obituary is here: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/28/science/space/28lange.html) I taught Physics 1 with Andrew for three years when I was just starting grad school, and knew him not only as a brilliant scientist and excellent teacher but also as an incredibly warm, supportive, and positive person. I would never, in a million years, have guessed that he would someday take his own life.

I was nowhere near as close to Andrew as Tom was to Dan, but for the first time I understand, in a small way, the pain and confusion Tom must have endured (and, in diminished form, must still be enduring). Thank you, Tom, for sharing Dan with us.

I also lost my friend Sam Roweis: http://samroweis1972-2010.blogspot.com/

In November, recovery was a mere hope; now, it is a growing reality.

I'm glad to hear it. Welcome back.

Thanks, bud; I'm thrilled to be back!

Over the past few months there have been a couple of times I wanted to post something in remembrance but I never really knew quite what to say or how to say it. I never knew Dan. In fact, when he died in September and the HN colors changed for a weekend, I still didn't know who he was. At the time, though, I was knee-deep in learning Django and I had actually come across his blog a number of times - always helpful! In reading through the threads at the time, I felt like I sort of got to know him.

I think sometimes that the internet is always moving forward and despite the huge outpouring of support from this community, it can feel like you're the only one who remembers after a couple of weeks.

My point is this: despite never knowing Dan, I can tell from what you've written, what this community had to say about him, and from his writing, that he was a great founder, a great friend, and a great guy. And I want you to know that you are not the only one poorer for the loss, that even a random guy on the internet that you don't even know remembers and appreciates him.

For those not aware of the connection, Dan was known and respected around here as fallentimes - http://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=fallentimes

Terrific, heart-felt piece -- I hope writing and publishing it was therapeutic and helpful on the road to recovery. That road has no end, but the further you get, the closer you are to 'normalcy'.

Knowing how much respect and admiration I had for Dan from the dozen or so interactions I had with him, I can't imagine the impact he had on a life-long friend. I've said it before and I'll say it again: I doubt I'll ever encounter anyone as genuine and charismatic as Dan.

Best of luck to you Tom. Though we've never spoken, Dan held you in the highest regard. My thoughts continue to be with you and everyone else Dan left behind.

Sorry to hear that. It's such a tragedy when someone close to you dies and worse when they take their own life.

I lost someone dear to me to suicide 1 month ago today, it's difficult to come to grips with just how final death really is and all the things you could or would have done if you'd had known.

He's at peace now, remember that as you move forward.

Take care of your friends and loved ones, everyone. Mental illness takes on all forms, and plagues so many people without ever showing to the outside world.

It's also worth remembering that people sometimes commit suicide without suffering from any mental illness at all. These people need help too.

Mental illness isn't always something that is persistent and never goes away. Its my understanding that most people experience some form of mental illness at some period in their lives. It is also my understanding that if your mind is in a state to contemplate or commit suicide, you are then currently experiencing mental illness.

wouldn't you have to conclude that one who makes such a choice is in some way mentally ill? Excepting terminal illness, I can't see how it makes sense otherwise.

Please don't take this the wrong way, I'm legitimately curious. I have friends who struggle with depression, some of whom clearly have contemplated this terrible 'solution'.

Why the scare quotes? It's a bona fide solution. When you kill yourself, the problem goes away. Also, why terrible? It may be terrible for the friends and family, but the person committing suicide certainly has nothing to lose by it. A loss is only a loss if you perceive it as such. You won't perceive anything after you die.

Theory: we'd all be better off if suicide were socially acceptable. The people who commit suicide "out of blue" probably consider talking to someone about it, but they know it will be seen as a cry for help, and met with banal pleas to not do it. Maybe they'd like to have a rational conversation instead, one where their right of choice would be respected. Inability to have such a conversation leads to alienation, which makes them more likely to kill themselves.

"Maybe they'd like to have a rational conversation instead, one where their right of choice would be respected. Inability to have such a conversation leads to alienation, which makes them more likely to kill themselves."

This is the part that is important. The only time you get to have this conversation is if you fail and are assigned a psychiatrist. Even then no one else will talk to you about it as they assume that it was just something you were going through and should have got over it by now.

If you raise the topic people panic and assume the worst. So despite the fact that I can now, after nearly 40 years of this, monitor my own state of mind and actually see that I am getting depressed I still can't talk to anyone when I feel it coming on.

I have had depression since I was a teenager, it comes and goes, but each time it is a little harder to cope with, or maybe I'm just getting older. If it was some other physical ailment then I could talk about it, if I was bereaved I could talk about it. But as it's a mental health issue and I appear to be otherwise fine, I have no one I can talk to. But I'm damn good at covering it up! Simply because people don't even want to talk about the weather with someone who is depressed, so to have any conversation at all you have to lock it away.

It sucks not to be able to talk.

we'd all be better off if suicide were socially acceptable

millions of years of evolution can't be wrong about how to fool otherwise intelligent creatures into sticking around.

I can see how if someone was pushed to the limit eventually suicide would become a rational choice. If the pain gets too intense it becomes pretty easy to take the easy way out. Some people avoid it by going to religion, others can't make that leap and thus find another way to make it stop: suicide.

Sure mental illnesses needlessly cause suicide, but it's not impossible for someone to achieve a point of hopelessness where suicide becomes a natural expected rational decision.

But I agree with you, it should never be thought of as the rational choice, because there is always hope for better. And no, you don't have to fabricate that hope either. It's what keeps me working, applying to yc despite rejection, and staying alive the for the next day despite all my shortcomings and failures. All without the need for a religion. I still haven't got to where I want to be, but I have hope.

Thanks for sharing and glad to hear you're dealing better with your loss. It actually makes me want to work on a loss I haven't been able to deal with after many years.

I'll keep treating life as the game it is

And I find that we should all remember this. We easily get caught up in whatever we're doing, discussing why the iPad is great or a disaster, while, maybe, we should just relax a bit and have people over this week-end…

I lost my sister in late September 2008. Your first posting about Dan hit me on the anniversary of her death.

It hurts. And it will for a long time.

It must hurt terribly. I'm really sorry.

A CEO friend of mine in the local tech industry took his own life the day before Dan in Sept.I had never talked to Dan, but enjoyed his posts on Hacker News. I had talked to my friend at length a few days before he died. I had no idea he was depressed. I read your posts and felt - what was going on? Was this some kind of psychic fallout of the economic depression? Or perhaps just circumstance. It made me slow down, focus on my loved ones. At the funeral, the priest said "Look at the hearse outside. It won't be followed by an armored truck and a UHaul, it will be followed by all of you (2000 of us)." That comment echoed in my head then, and it still does today. Thank you for your considerate writing and comforting thoughts.

This is beautiful man. I was really sad when I came home after talking to you about this last weekend - I hadn't known. But reading this brought a different kind of tears to my eyes. You're an inspiration.

I'm so glad it touched you and that you got something out of it; that's the best compliment my inner writer can receive :)

Good luck! Reading this, I feel hopeful and sad for you, but mostly envy at your having had such a wonderful friend in your life. I'm not sure I've had many (any?) friends of that caliber.

My good friend Vijay just committed suicide in late December. It's still so fresh. He was a student here, one of the smartest at our ACM student chapter at UIUC.

It seems impossible to do anything sufficient to honor or remember him. I feel for you.

I read about this when it happened, and this post was extremely eloquent and thoughtful.

Tom, I'd be happy to join you in whipping some Korean butt come Starcraft 2 launch. Even if you don't take my offer up, know that I'm going to think of Dan when I run my first Zerg rush.

Thank you for sharing this post.

The Jack Kerouac quote is so fitting for the piece. Very touching and heartfelt story.

I'm happy to hear you've made peace with this experience and the ghost of your friend.

I love that quote; the more I read it the more I'm touched by it. For the record, my girlfriend recommended it for inclusion.

How is Dans' family doing?

Even if I can't bring him back or comprehend why he left, I can take solace in keeping his spirit alive.

which you do beautifully by inspiring the rest of us with...

Brick walls were mere speed bumps to him.

Thank you, Tom. Best wishes on your continuing recovery.

Reading this outpouring of sentiment about how awesome a person Dan was makes me sad, mostly because I wonder whether he knew how people felt about him when he was alive.

Receiving heartfelt appreciation from someone you know or love is phenomenally uplifting.

"If you admire somebody, you should go head and tell em' / People never get the flowers, while they can still smell em'." - Kanye

I'm going to go call some loved ones now and tell them how important they are to me.

Who is Dan and where can I learn more about him?

* http://ticketstumbler.com/blogs/new-stuff/2009/10/03/a-terri...

* http://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=fallentimes

* http://ycombinator.com/dan.html

This seems like an appropriate place to post this: Another YCombinator founder, Florian Hufsky (Claimspotting, S'08, never launched), committed suicide in December.

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