Trucker Explains What You're Doing Wrong on the Highway | Hacker News Reader

Trucker Explains What You're Doing Wrong on the Highway

popularmechanics.com

33 pointsprostoalex32 comments

Where I drive (UK), truck drivers are by far the worst drivers on the road. Many of them are from Europe and used to driving on the right side of the road, not the left side in the UK. If this was the only issue it would be bad enough, but truck drivers in general have some very dangerous and nasty habits I see every day, without fail, while driving.

The biggest issue is overtaking of slow trucks by other trucks. Trucks will indicate and then change lane simultaneously, into gaps that only barely have room for their truck. Bad luck if you are approaching at normal highway speed and now have to brake heavily to avoid rear ending a truck that has just appeared in your lane, travelling 20 mph more slowly. Bad luck if you are the driver that just had a huge truck appear 2 inches behind you and now you have to do an emergency stop. Also bad luck if you happen to be next to the truck and in their blind spot. They just don't care, after all they would not even notice if you rear ended them, or they squashed your car against a side barrier.

Many accidents are caused by this, to the extent that there is talk about banning overtaking by trucks on some highways. Truck drivers are also guilty of travelling way too fast for the conditions, tailgating and other cardinal sins of the road.

This seems to be particularly bad in the UK, as I have lived/worked in other countries and usually truck drives in other countries realize they are driving huge, slow to stop killing machines and are far more aware and respectful of that.

Not much better on the continent, either - except for the right-side driving, of course. (There actually is a law around these parts that says "no trucks in the fast lane" - guess how effective it is)

I don't think it's just an issue of no trucks on the fast lane.

If you drive on 3 or 4 lane roads, such as the M25, there is a visible disturbance to traffic flow even when a truck enters lane 2 on a 4 lane road. This has the effect of pushing all people that drive between 60 and 70mph out of lane 2 and into lane 3, where the average speed is between 70 and 80mph. This, in turn, pushes slower moving traffic into Lane 4 (inside lane) where its not uncommon to see people driving between 80 and 90mph. The overall net result is an awful amount of breaking, lane changing and short spacing between cars.

Where I drive (UK), truck drivers are by far the worst drivers on the road.

It might vary by state, but in general in the USA truckers nowadays are pretty well behaved. IMO.

But go back 50 years and they were insane. They were usually the fastest vehicles on the road. They'd blow by you in the fast lane almost like you were standing still. Also truckers had licenses from multiple states and/or fake licenses. So they didn't care much if they got tickets. And if there were restrictions on how many hours they could drive, they weren't enforced. So, not only were they crazy, they were tired or strung out on pills. And the sides of the highways were littered with the carcasses of retread truck tires that happened to disintegrate with depressing regularity.

Trucker behavior really changed a few decades ago when the Federal government got more serious about enforcing various laws. E.g. time limits and not allowing truckers to have multiple licenses.

So then the worst drivers were the morons in SUVs, yakking on cell phones, oblivious to the world. Why should they care, they're in a giant SUV so they're invincible, right? Whenever I spotted a driver drifting around in his lane, or speeding up and slowing down erratically, the odds were at least 80% that a cell phone was involved.

It's gotten a lot better now, because many states have made it illegal to use a non-hands-free cell phone in a car.

If a trucker is tailgating you: immediately let them pass, read the phone number off the back, report them.

Former truck driver from germany here. Sure, you shouldn't tailgate as a truck driver. His point is still valid. There are very few good reasons (read exceptionally bad conditions) for going slower than a truck's max speed. 90% of the time, people are just not paying attention. From the truck drivers perspective, this is nearly coercion, especially where overtaking is forbidden. I once tried to overtake a car on a highway in southern Germany which went like 80 km/h. I drove a 60t mobile crane, limited to 89 km/h (like most of the trucks in Europe are). When she realised that, she accelerated and I had to stop the maneuver. Then she fell back to 80 km/h again. Rinse and repeat for two times. Guess what I did then. Hint: There was some serious honking involved, too.

Also please keep in mind there is a grey area between tailgating and starting a passing maneuver and at least in my country it is tolerated to reduce the safety distance in order to start overtaking.

Comments like this are why I'll cheer for that profession being automated away.

Because he had to explain a situation where a driver in front of him caused a very dangerous situation and felt he had to respond in that way?

As much as I love driving, there will be many improvements when we don't have to drive to get to our jobs and things anymore. I'll get to go and play on a race-track, sure; but I won't have to be all hands on deck at 8 or 9 in the morning with everyone else who woke up 30 minutes to an hour ago.

The truck driver caused the dangerous situation by tailgating. There's no right to drive at the speed limit, and certainly no justification for causing danger when another driver is annoying you.

That's a bit of a tricky one though. A large truck can't stop very fast. They may end up tailgating if the car in front reduces speed.

If you are in a car it's definitely your responsibility to make sure you're doing the right thing. You're a lot more nimble and more able to make manoeuvres.

It is everyone's responsibility to do the right thing, but when someone does something wrong, it's completely unacceptable to make a more hazardous situation in response.

While true, unless there are extenuating circumstances (weather, limping car, etc), it's better to drive near the speed limit.

Much of the danger in driving occurs when there's a substantial difference in speed between cars. (I imagine the second most common time there's an accident is when cars are going almost exactly the same speed[1]). Driving 10 under can be very dangerous.

[1] my thinking here is that if you have 2 cars going almost exactly the same speed, but one is sitting in the other's blindspot, then one of them can attempt to change lanes and the other might miss it and suddenly accident.

Actually you can ticketed in many places for slowing down traffic for no reason.

There are a lot of reasons for automated driving and most of them have something to do with human behaviour. Sorry for trying to put the statement about tailgating into perspective.

I think many truckers would welcome more automation. I know I would have when I was driving. The scenario you describe happens very regularly - A truck with speed limiter going down the road with cruise control for many hundreds of miles consistently - A car driver who makes a conscious decision to become a nuisance. The choice for the trucker is to either allow the other driver to choose a new lower speed for the truck, or attempt to intimidate the car in front which is actively preventing the pass and choosing to antagonize you. Neither choice is a good one, and that's where the automation comes in, to remove human emotions from the equation.

One thing that you should remember if you are the type of car driver that does this is that truckers are communicating with each other and not all of them are safety minded, or driving a company truck with a phone number on the back. What this means for you is that you may succeed in your little power trip against the truck behind and then have an unpleasant experience with one of the trucks up ahead. It's not right but it does happen. Some of these drivers are sociopaths who would be delighted to run you off the road.

For clarity, I'm not talking about quick little misunderstandings or short periods of distraction while a car driver makes a mobile phone call or sends a text. I'm talking about the parent comment with a truck attempting to pass a slow car and that car speeding up to prevent the pass, and then repeating that process several times. This happens often and it's maddening. You have to just let it go but you do wonder about the car driver, and why they choose to have a pissed off trucker following them. Automation can help with this for sure, and the car driver can go find another person to annoy.

You described a situation where a human truck driver, led by emotion and impatience, recklessly put lives in danger. An automated driver would not have reacted with annoyance and frustration.

In Germany, the max. allowed speed for trucks this large is 80 km/h. Therefore, no need to overtake, if she drove 80 km/h.

Or, try to honor the speed limit in construction areas, which are at least 80 km/h, sometimes 60 km/h. Especially in the latter situation, it is guaranteed that a truck WILL tailgate you, sometimes honking. Around here it is pretty dangerous to honor such speed limits even if they are justified.

And not to talk about bad weather conditions. Just a few days ago I needed to drive though heavy mist with pretty bad visual conditions. Trucks where overtaking all the time despite seeing nothing. If there had been a traffic jam it would have been impossible to stop quickly enough.

While on paper the allowed speed is 80 km/h, in fact it is 89 which is the hard-wired technical max speed of most trucks. Additionally, driving 89 is not prosecuted. In a capitalist world, a trucking company whose trucks sticked to 80 km/h would vanish very soon. Therefore 89 km/h is the standard speed. If a driver decides to go slower than that, trucks will try to pass them, period. Additionally, there is the "Richtgeschwindigkeit" for cars of 130 km/h in Germany as you may be aware of.

That being said, I do not endorse tailgating or speeding in any way. I just wanted to add another perspective.

Having known someone who was crushed to death by a trucker rear-ending their car in stop and go traffic: truckers should never tail-gate.

He said tail-gating as in 3-4 car lengths. Admittedly, that is tailgating for a vehicle that takes forever to stop; but, this isn't the big scary monster right behind you situation. They're further back, but just as unable to stop

I once saw something quite the opposite. Some ditzy woman in a tiny car changed lanes right in front of a huge tractor-trailer. It was an urban situation and a light just ahead just turned red. So she immediately braked.

The cut-off truck behind her slammed on his brakes and swerved into the other lane and jackknifed in a huge cloud of tire smoke. But he did it, his cab wound up beside her and totally missed her car. He didn't turn her econobox into a grease spot.

I was too stunned to remember what happened afterward. But I think the woman just obliviously drove off when the light changed. She never realized just how close she came to dying that day.

It's 2016. Cameras are a thing. Why are blindspots still legal?

> I almost ran this guy off the road because I couldn't see him. [...] He was right along my right-hand side. What can I do?

Stopped reading and started screaming at the computer after that comment. What can you do? Pay attention to what you're doing before you change lanes. You almost killed someone and you're blaming them? My vehicle has blind spots too, when I'm changing lanes I look to make sure that there isn't someone there prior to changing lanes.

This whole article just screams stereotypical "I own the road" egomaniac trucker to me.

> If you see a truck in your rearview, the first thing you need to do is put down your phone.

Seriously, just assuming that someone is on their phone?

> when you see it's a soccer mom with a van full of kids.

sigh

I know this is in popular mechanics so they're just playing to their audience, but, this is low even for them.

This whole article just screams stereotypical "I own the road" egomaniac trucker to me.

Your comment just screams stereotypical "I have never driven anything larger than a station wagon" to me.

Seriously, consider the length of a tractor-trailer. Then consider the size of the mirrors and their location. Add in bad weather, where the crap coming off the wheels creates a veritable fog bank alongside and behind every vehicle.

Don't drive in anyone's blind spot. And especially don't drive in a large truck's blind spot. Being legally in the right doesn't matter if you're dead or stuck on the side of the road with weeks of chatting with your insurance agent ahead of you.

My takeaway from the article was that the driver was actively trying to spot the car prior to changing lanes, and because the car remained in their blind spot for an extended period the trucker went ahead and changed lanes only to learn too late that the car was there. I didn't think there was any intent to do harm to the car.

Let me tell you about a personal experience which may help illustrate the problem, and help you be safer when driving your car around trucks. Years ago I was driving a 'cabover' tractor-trailer (the kind with no hood, it's straight down from the front windows to the bunper). I had only five months experience but I was doing pretty good so far. I came up behind a car on a four-lane highway that was going slow, so I started to pass. The car was black and the sun was low and opposite, so as I began to pass and check my mirrors, I made a mental note that the black car riding on blacktop in the shade was harder to see than the other cars further back. No problem, I accelerated more and the car dropped back near my trailer tires. My exit was a couple miles ahead so I wanted to get back over into the slow lane. I looked in the mirrors and the car was gone. I took a long, hard look in the mirrors again and slowed down, in case the car had sped up again and was in my blind spot next to the truck. Nothing. A pickup truck in the slow lane flashed his lights, which is a courtesy signal meaning 'come on back over' that a lot of truckers and work trucks do. I started to change lanes back to the slow lane, nice and slowly, 3-4 seconds of turn signal in advance, and heard tires starting to skid. I held position and scanned all my mirrors again, trying to find where the noise was coming from. I slowed down more. No clue, just a loud skidding noise of tires dragging on pavement. It sounded like a long skid and I was waiting for the impact sound. I thought I'd better get over in the slow lane because someone was in the middle of a huge skid and was going to crash. I completed the lane change and slowed down more, and was horrified to see the black car flop around sideways in front of me, stuck to my bumper. A quick panic stop and I was relieved to see the man inside was fine. The side of his car was all chewed up from the tire lug bolts spinning against his door but he was calm and okay. When the police came he told them he was trying to stay in the shade next to me because he didn't like the low sun in his eyes, and he apologized for 'causing the accident'. It was totally my fault and the police cited me, but they gave me a really minor ticket for some obscure law because of the man's foolish decision. It was 100% my fault but he could have done more to help me avoid him, that's what I was making a genuine effort to do. His speeding up and slowing down to match my speed was dangerous, and you should never do this around trucks. They really can't see you well and there are a lot of other cars around they are trying to keep track of. Hope that helps you avoid an accident in your car some day.

It could be worse - riding a heavy loaded bike in Uttar Pratesh and Bihar. You have no idea.)

> People think we are the safety hazards. But we're not. We know how to drive defensively.

E=mv^2

Semi: 36000kg

SUV: 3600kg

Compact: 1800kg

Cycle: 360kg

For a semi moving at 100kph, these are the speeds where smaller vehicles would have the same kinetic energy:

SUV: 316kph

Compact: 447kph

Cycle: 1000kph

Just sayin' ;)

They also have a shit load more training than most of the other vehicles you mentioned and generally drive slower.

They'd arguably be safe if they drove at 30kph, in dedicated and isolated lanes. But at 100kph, they are far too dangerous.

...and that's where the conflict with usability comes in. The whole JIT-delivery economy (which is most of the economy, these days) would go down the drain if you suddenly slowed it down three times. Also, 30 kph gets you horrible mileage and emissions with current engines.

It doesn't make a difference for your results, but it's

    E = 0.5 mv^2

How embarrassing ;)

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