Ask HN: The Struggles of Poverty and Trying to become a programmer from 0 | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: The Struggles of Poverty and Trying to become a programmer from 0

27 pointspoveritysucks31 comments

I'm an African-American male based in Seattle. Code fellows is only a bus ride away from me but can't afford it. College is expensive. CodeFellows is expensive. Can barely live off Mim wage warehouse job.

Trying to jump-start your career and get into Web development as a low-income African male is a tough mission. Everyone else seems so privileged comparing to me. I want a career in Web development but see no hope right now. Financial barrier, even Udacity is charing now $200 per month per nano course! and I thought Udacity was the only way to make it into tech for someone like me until they got money hungry.

what is your advice?

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Start hacking.

CodeFellows/Udacity/College is expensive. Hack: Figure out what they teach you, and find other, cheaper sources of the same information. (edit: Check out Zed Shaw's stuff http://learnrubythehardway.org/book/ http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/)

CodeFellows/Udacity/College says they teach you what you need to know to get a job. Hack: Ask employers directly what they look for when hiring. Learn that instead.

I don't have experience/proof of skills. Hack: Start posting your work online. (Get a free blog or use GitHub or something.) Even if it's a tiny thing. Bit by bit, day by day, you'll be proving that you can ship something. When someone asks what you can do, show them the site. (edit: A shining example is Jennifer Dewalt's 180 Websites in 180 days: http://jenniferdewalt.com/)

I don't know people who can help me. Hack: Find your local web development meetup and go. Don't sit in the corner. Meet people. Get their contact into. Tell them what you're trying to accomplish. Ask them for advice. (People love to give advice.) Email them later and let them know you enjoyed meeting them. Thank them for their advice. Build relationships.

This is fantastic advice. Pretty much exactly what I did to get to the point of being employable (when not working on my own ideas). Starting from a position pretty similar to the OP.

The most important part of this is the emphasis on releasing code on a consistent basis. I'm 6 years into my journey and am still doing this pretty regularly. Example: https://github.com/Tapha/Custom-Highlight - A simple, open source text highlighter that allows you to add custom functions to it. Like the Medium editor.

Hi,

I was born and live in West-Africa, meaning epileptic power supply, expensive/slow/sometimes unavailable internet connection.

Right now I am a software developer with about 4 years in the game and yes I am self-taught like most people here, this was before things like Udacity and Khan academy. Google was my teacher. I believe you can see free online resources to learn how to program like I did, I've never used Udacity or any of those online learning sites, I read a lot and use HN to keep abreast of latest news in tech. You are in America for crying out loud! is it not supposed to be a land of opportunity? With enough courage and determination, I believe you can do anything.

PS: Right now I work as a remote developer for companies in New York, Calfornia and I've never been to the United States before. I believe you can do anything if you put your mind to it.

There is nothing stronger for motivation than a very good example coming from someone with a similar background. It is up to you poveritysucks.

I lived in my car for 8 months this year. When I didn't have a job I was at the public library everyday reading about and writing code. I applied for every job I could anywhere in the country. Eventually it paid off and I got a job.

Playing the race card on why life is hard is a cop out. You have to put effort into this. You cannot huff and puff your way into it.

This site is filled with people posting blogs and sites that contain free tutorials.

"Playing the race card on why life is hard is a cop out."

What a shitty, thoughtless thing to say. Life is significantly harder for african americans. That's a fact; dismissing experiences is an ignorant thing to do.

I'm pretty sure he knows he needs to keep on trucking in spite of that, or he wouldn't be posting here. But being african american has and will cost him several "well, let's give this kid a chance" foot-in-the-doors that white guys experience pretty frequently (like me).

You can learn everything you need to know for free, at least to get started.

The only barrier to entry is having internet access and a computer and some spare time in the evening and on weekends.

Email me and I'll point you in the right direction to get started. HN username @ gmail.

Best of luck mate! I was a McNair scholar in college, even though I am caucasian I still faced my share of challenges and lack of what privelage can bring. To me, that privilege is largely in the sense of self-worth and knowledge about little things such as applying for Pell grants. Financial aid can be enough to allow one to live on in cheaper school areas. A college education for many is less important, but coming from a background such as yours can help establish credibility quickly and provide a broader sense of life. I'd recommend considering it, and especially fill out the FAFSA to see what help you could get (https://fafsa.ed.gov).

College is still expensive and particularly so in a big city like Seattle. I live in Boise and would highly recommend moving to a more inexpensive city such as Portland or Boise. Rent in Boise, for example, is often only $400 for your own. The job market is also often better in these smaller towns. However, family ties often bind us to a place, so there may be smaller outlying towns around Seattle which have community colleges and such while still being cheaper.

If you decide college still isn't for you, I'd heartily recommend doing what many of the other posts say: start hacking! Committing to open source projects is a great way to build a portfolio. Another good approach is to start offering to build websites for friends, family, colleagues, and well anybody. You probably know people or acquaintances who have small businesses (construction, stores, ...) that would like to have a website or inventory system but don't realize that it's both relatively cheap to get a website. Listen and offer to do cheap help setting up websites on WordPress, etc. A side benefit is it can help your own community in a positive way. For example, help make a website for "Aunt Matilda's lawn and gardening services".

I would also recommend reading classic authors who overcame difficult situations and valued practical skills [Up From Slavery - Booker T. Washington](http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/2376).

There are free Coursera courses available for webdev:

https://www.coursera.org/specializations/full-stack

It lists a price for each course, but you can actually access the material without paying anything. You have an option to pay in case you want a certificate.

Moreover, CS courses on Coursera have extremely high quality. As the guy above said, you can access the material for free.

Actually, you can even hack the paid certificate. Coursera has a financial aid policy, allowing poor people to have the certificates without paying. You should apply for that!

Subscribe to newsletters from Udemy, StackSkills, Stone River Academy, and the BGR Store. They often have specials where you can get a whole bundle of online courses AND there are several that have a project that you complete and can add to your portfolio. They've had deals where you can pick up 10+ courses for $20. I also echo the recommendation to go through the MIT or Stanford courses. Check out edX for many of those. As someone else said, it really never has been better. I even attended a free CSS3 tricks class from Noble Desktop earlier in the week. It was a gift for being a subscriber to their newsletter. It was live and they created a GoToMeeting for me and the instructor took my questions and paid me plenty of attention. Great free two hours of my time!

Good luck, you CAN do it!

I'll do what I can to help you if you are serious about learning. Email me at partisanyc at gmail.

You can download all the programming books you'll ever need for free with bittorrent. Its like Frank Zappa once said, "If you want to get laid, go to college. If you want an education, go to the library."

If I were in your situation, I'd get an entry level job in an unrelated field, get a loan and go to college part time.

There's lots of reasons why you'd want to go to college:

1. You want to future proof yourself against ageism. It's much harder without a degree.

2. It's a really good place to find entry level IT jobs that do not require a degree/experience.

3. Once you're done you are not limited to working in web developement but in a wider range of IT and software development jobs

4. Sort of the same as no 2 but employers would really rather hire the guy who is working through college over the guy who is not, even though both lack a degree.

5. A degree is useful for a lot of things. Many visas require one, for example.

There is a glut of free resources for learning to program The first thing is find a community with a computer if you do not have one second, look for things that interest you as this would help you build your online portfolio third get a github account & codepen to show of your work fourth Follow a free web development program like freecodecamp which teaches HTML, CSS, JS and MEAN stack fifth talk to people to keep your sanity and for support sixth don't give up seventh good luck :)

Whhhhatttt?

Man I became a coder at 14 years old (10 years ago) when there was no where near the online resources there are now. I come from a low-income family I didnt take courses and I couldn't tbh, not because of prices but because there were none available anyway.

Get a book, join a community. =). Just start practicing. Do stuff for free, find charities that need some web dev and build a portfolio whilst doing good things for people.

Also, you can do the udacity courses ALL FOR FREE. The only difference is you don't get a certificate. And a certificate isn't exactly needed..

I've been working on a free service for some time now to allow freelancers to find jobs and understand the job market. It currently contains data from upwork.com and allows you to search for jobs and see various analysis of the job market.

Try it out

http://upstats.garage-coding.com/#search/jobs

All feedback is valuable and I use it to improve the service.

pluralsight is only $29/mo has a lot of training material. I bought it when I was unemployed. Also, look at upwork.com you might find some project to get you experience. I'm surprised you can't get college tuition assistance: https://fafsa.ed.gov/

Before I got a job after my degree:

1. I wrote a Point of sale system for my uncle's pizza shop. ( was supposed to get paid)

2. wrote a POS system for a friends print shop($10/hr) 93'

3. wrote a POS for a storage unit company($10/hr) 95'

each of these used it for themselves and hoped to sell it to other companies.

4. wrote an e-commerce site for a online card company($15/hr). 98' found this on an ad on campus bulletin board.

look at jobs from the state or local government. They are good way to get your foot in the door.

is pluralsight like lynda? sometimes the direction to take without guide is what gets to me.

sounds real similar. I would go to the job boards and find the skills most employers are looking for and brush up on them. Next, if you know any one that owns a business try to write a software program for them.

Visual studio dev essentials is offering a code for 6 months of Pluralsight ($49/mo level) for free. I would check that out.

If you can get online, you can take courses from Khan Academy for free. Stanford Online is free as well, and MIT has put a lot of lecture videos and course materials online for free. There are thousands of tutorials on any subject you care to study. Really, it has never been better.

I keep learning all these things but what do I do with it is the main obstacle for me.

Build a portfolio. Do real projects for people. If you really have no experience, then you can offer your services to people at a low cost. I'd shy away from people who need things completely free unless they're legit, and either a charity or have no chance of making money either (e.g., a band). Look on craigslist for projects. I wouldn't spend another dollar on learning anything.

Or, do projects for yourself. You can host them on GitHub for free and open source it.

1. Freelancer.com 2. Fiver.com

My most important advice to you is to make friends who are programmers. As many as possible. How? Join programming themed forums, introduce yourself, help others out when you can by answering questions and offering to help any other way.

Programming competitions online would help you pick up new skills and experience faster.

Lastly, write programs everyday. It doesn't really matter what you write. It doesn't also matter if it's a little script or a large one. Keep at it and you'll be alright.

PS: Be patient and try to have fun. Thinking mainly about money right now will likely frustrate you. Good luck.

I would start by looking for a QA,producer, or support role and then work your way up. Those positions are entry level and pay a lot more than minimum all you need is basic technical skills.

Have you tried http://freecodecamp.com/ I'm going through it at the moment. I'm no programmer, but found it really interesting.

This is all you need. Good luck bro.

http://www.theodinproject.com/

Do you have a project that you can work on? Lack of a syllabus is a problem, so having a structure means you learn what you need to complete the project.

You then build up a portfolio.

There are many roads to doing what you are attempting to do. Just having access to the internet and a computer is a huge start. You are in a tough position, but I'm living in the Philippines where many have no access to a computer and some don't even have electricity.

Much of a career in web development (or anything) is about dealing with people. Communicating with your employers, team, clients and anyone else you need to deal with. Along with the technical components, take some time to practice writing and learning good grammar. You can take free online classes for writing and grammar. Writing well is one of the most powerful ways to come across as a professional who can solve problems. You'll be judged on this before you even get to the point of demonstrating technical ability.

Have you built anything? If not, then start there. Web development is a craft, it's about building stuff. For me, building came first. My passion in creating things to solve my own problems and sharing those things on the internet put me on the path to paid work, not the other way around. You don't need to go through courses to start building. Start with a Google search. Dedicate one hour every day to build on this first step. Increase the time you devote to this journey as you are able. Keep a journal of your progress.

Find communities of other developers and contribute your knowledge. Ask questions when you get tripped up (though in the beginning, you will find most of these questions answered already.) Build up your reputation, which will also add to your "authority score." As this score grows, others will seek you out for your knowledge. Once you have demand for attention from others, then you have the platform from which to get paid for your skills.

Most of the above is for the "web developer" route. Always keep in mind the end mission of your work. You are setting out to create solutions to problems. Even if you are helping out other web developers, those developers are probably working to help a paying client make money. At the end of all roads is someone like Bob Jones making a transaction with Amy Johnson. These are two great people who may know nothing about what you are doing, but Bob needs your help to advance his business. Amy loves what Bob is doing and feels that Bob's work makes her life a little bit better. Be a good guy and help make Bob and Amy's life a little bit brighter.

You will also have to do a bit of hustling. Don't wait for things to come to you, go out and get them. Go ahead and take courses, but drive your education through your own building and discovery. Don't send out resumes. Directly contact agencies and dev shops that you find on the internet. Find out who works for these places and follow them on social networking, Github, Stack Exchange and other platforms. Interact with them when you see the chance. If you can't get a job right away, go knock on Bob's door (and all the other doors in the community) and let Bob know that you can help him out. When you get Bob's go ahead, treat him like royalty. Even if you make mistakes on the technical side as you are starting out, Bob will always appreciate the person who treats him and his concerns as #1. Most people would take the money and follow-up with a half ass job. If you are different, then you are way ahead of everyone else.

Use the courses to supplement the above. They shouldn't be your driver. Remember that the vets who are celebrating their 10 year anniversary today as web developers didn't have all these courses available. We had books, documentation and for some things we sort of blazed our own paths.

Good luck and have a great 2016.

I am currently struggling with similar tough situation.I see some helpful advice here but honestly, its easier said than done.

-I am a latina, working in retail, no support of any kind whatsoever, surviving and on top of that with an expensive autoimmune medical condition. My job is in retail working long stressful hours, no benefits, no vacations. That leaves almost no time to study or hack around because I need to work in order to survive. Many things regarding web development requires owning a Mac computer that many people can't afford or taking some basics classes around which are not free. Nowadays, if you have internet access and a simple computer that should be enough. Guess what? Many people cant even pay for those basics needs. I just bought a Mac with money I don't have...hopefully it will pay in the future. But there are people even in the US with less choices than your average person. For example, many people lack credit access and money to buy computers, have internet access, buy books, go to places...hard to believe but it's true. When I first was diagnosed with my medical condition, I did not have insurance or financial help and all I needed was less than $2000 for my medical tests. No one helped me financially even when asked for help. I lost my hair, couldn't go to work so I did not earn money for those days, had some skin rashes due to my conditions. How can I be able to meet people like that? or study? I spent my few savings on all that. Thankfully, I recovered and my medical situation is now manageable. But It was a painful situation...I am afraid to face the same situation in the future: Health vs rent? Because eating became my third choice...

I applied to many free hack/development schools just to be denied from all of them. The last one I applied at the beginning of December 2015 just denied me I believe for not completing a bunch of tests/quizzes in order to get in. Guess why I couldn't finished? I was working long hours during holidays and did not have a computer and they required a mac. So I rushed to get one just to complete my tasks, didn't get sleep in order to advance some tests, and put some internet and the Mac on a credit card(at least now I have access to one but It wasn't always like that). When I put my internet to begin working on those entrance quizzes which are really long tasks, I saw my denial email. That was 2 days ago...I allowed myself to cry that whole day. Today, my plan is to keep my mac computer and try to pay if off little by little and study from free sources.

I live in NYC, my bills are not expensive because I have learned to budget after my health vs rent situation 2 years ago...but it's tiring to live with so many constrains.It's tiring to not have vacations AT ALL not even holidays off. I understand that my situation could be worse if I didn't plan my steps everyday. I just pray things don't get worse for me, especially health-wise.

This is what I recommend since you live in a big city like me:

-Try to eliminate your debt if you have any so you can get easier access to stuff in the future like loans. credit card, set up internet accounts, etc. -Try to get a credit card by doing #1 and buy yourself a refurbished or cheap Mac computer as many schools/teaching tools are really requiring a Mac -Get access to public library and have a card -try to get cheap internet access by shopping around. I don't have cable tv just cheap internet -Read free sources online and get free ebooks about programming -Check around for free development schools/IT programs in your city. NYC offers some or with minimal financing...apply if you can.Apply to all of them and don't give up...within your city that is. -Go to meetup groups and try to network.

NYC Fellowships just denied me, I don't qualify for Per Scholas here in NYC since I am currently working and need my job to survive...Treehouse is not longer free with public library access as it used to be. I fell into any possible crack in every situation. I feel forgotten by everyone in every situation and I am afraid. But I don't have much choice but to keep fighting.

I don't have friends in the industry, I don't have a mentor or someone to guide me in my journey. I have no financial help. All I know is that I love computers and programming, I have to survive and I need money to cover my unpredictable medical condition and I only have my own help for all that.Also, I am tired of working every day of the year. I want at least JULY 4th, Christmas and New Years off.Or even a week vacation...I want to leave my soul sucking job...these are " basics" things but many people lack them.For me, just having one of them , it's a privilege. I finally got my hair back and my skin rashes are more manageable, so now I am ready to meet new people and be more presentable.Better keep up now because I feel my time is limited due to my health condition. Who knows when I will lose my hair again and all that? I better be positive about my situation and don't stress myself more about my struggles.

Just believe in yourself, don't forget what you want and your needs, keep fighting and don't give up. Don't dwell in painful situations and don't allow yourself to cry for more that a day. Don't look back, just look forward but don't forget the reasons you are fighting for this. Don't really wait for a break, just go after what you want...

Hopefully, your situation turns around. Keep us updated...

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