Tesla is copying Apple's business model
blog.erratasec.com
blog.erratasec.com
He wants Costco (low cost, low price, high volume, slim overall profit) and Apple (low cost, high price, medium-to-small volume, large overall profit) and Tesla (currently I believe high cost, high price, low volume, negative overall profit) to be the same, and so he constantly elides the differences. I think that overall his point is that Costco and Apple are fundamentally about having low costs that allow them to make a different volume/price tradeoff than their competitors, but he constantly confuses price and cost, and contradicts himself about Apple's volume.
-edit random thought- Seems like a whole lot of wealthy tech writers/bloggers want to sell themselves on getting a Tesla because somehow its similar to buying an early mac. There should be a specific term for the tech version of Keeping Up With The Joneses. I wonder how many of them drink soylent and order their quarters off of quarterly. I realize I am on a 'startup centric' site but god damn man some introspection is good people.
Surely if you think Apple/Tesla is going to be great, the smart move is to buy early shares, not early products? The products will still be good/relatively cheap in future - the shares won't.
I mean just like the saying its a extremely reductionist view of a person, but it touches on something in all of us and something too much in in a lot of us.
Ah, irony.
https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-...
As far as Tesla trying to make a cool brand; every brand tries to do that. That's not what makes Tesla like Apple.
What makes Tesla like Apple is that it is willing to compromise in ways that most of their competitors aren't; they are willing to have higher price tags, deliver products late and risk a lot of money by investing in something that could fail. Apple exmpales; the iPhone, the Apple Watch. Tesla examples; the Supercharger network and the Gigafactoy. They are not willing to compromise on quality. They may fuck up and make a quality mistake (inevitably they do), but they will not deliberately compromise on quality the way competitors will in order to meet a target price point.
In the areas that Apple competes there are a handful of serious competitors and they deliberately place themselves in markets where they know they can offer a superior experience. In the automative industry there are dozens of competitors. And most of them over at least some cars that are higher in quality than Tesla. And of course none of them have the problem of electric cars namely range and worrying about recharge locations. Which is a concern for the mainstream masses.
For me Tesla is more like the Windows Phone. A great product but with quite a lot of uncertainty around it's longterm future.
I don't think the masses drive 200 miles a day on the regular. That's $500+ a month in gas.
The distance is well inside the range of Tesla's battery if it wasn't for the altitude and the cold weather. If you don't have a charging station at your destination, better start walking...
It would also be worth adding that the part of Europe with good train coverage is "much of it".
I also get the impression that air transport in most of the rest of the world is much much more reasonable. AirAsia has made most of Asia pretty accessible, there are a gazillion competing low-cost airlines in Europe, and Australian air travel seems to be cheap enough that I have friends who city hop at weekends without much effort.
Of the four continents I've lived for more than a year on, North America and Africa see people taking heroic car journeys, Europe and (South East) Asia much less so.
Finally there seems to be a real class divide on public transport. Middle-class Europeans and Asians will jump on a coach, where I don't think any of the Americans I know have every been on a Greyhound bus...
Where I went to college, flights were often canceled and cost around 300$ one way. Between cities in the US we do have pretty competitive prices for flights. Cars were definitely the preferred means of transportation and if you car pooled the cheapest.
Oddly enough we had an ok bus system, it was pricy but the fare was included in your tuition.
To be fair, there was a point in my life when I was driving 900 miles round trip every other week or so, but that was about a girl, and before I had enough money to take a plane...and looking back I was viewed as crazy by most people for doing so.
Yes, but how did they get there? Twenty years ago, Apple made "a great product but with quite a lot of uncertainty around it's longterm future." Though I personally think that any comparisons are facile, the point is that Tesla is poised to follow a similar path.
It briefly touches upon objective vs subjective quality and does so in a way that it brings back memories of _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_. What is quality anyway? The author makes the case that Apple is an inherently quality brand through and through, and to do so, must invest into its own supply chain in order to get quality parts at a cheap cost. He then naturally draws the comparison to the Gigafactory Tesla is building. His conclusion is that the Tesla Model S (which he owns) will be how Tesla is ultimately perceived as a "quality" product. When it cheapens all the parts and sells a 35k car, presumably this will be like Apple selling iPhones. I think it's a worthwhile comparison.
It's also something to just generally keep in mind about branding. Many engineers might have snarky things to say about a marketing or executive moves, but customer perception is a huge deal. Android has generally stayed ahead of Apple in terms of releasing mobile features, but the higher-income earners still prefer Apple to Android. Why is that? These are the really interesting discussions, but no of course Tesla is not copying per se.. it's just trying to make a lot of money and well, selling cheap products at high costs because of perceived quality is a hell of a way to do that.
Tesla targets a high end niche market.
My middle class parents, would never dream of buying a Tesla but they have purchased Mac computers for as long as I have known them.
Honestly I don't see a huge amount of parallels other than they share a common fanbase, tech nerds and these fans want to lump them together, and they are... both businesses competing in the modern economy.
Seriously, it seems like commenters either aren't reading this article and/or have a bias against Tesla.
I am bias because I label Tesla as a company that sells the products that it sells? I don't get it.
Weren't the first Macs really expensive too?
Also I'm sorry I meant the Apple. To me they are the same computer. I understand historically they are not. I never said it wasn't expensive, even the Apple which MSRP ranged from 1,000$ to 2,000$ was still expensive but seems fairly competitive for the time. Cars are also pretty expensive tho lol. But luxury and sports cars are far outside the price-to-use range of a middle class family. A 'Apple' Computer, at least for my family, was worth it for them at that price range. A 20k car functions just as well as a 100k car, the Apple at 1k was pretty phenomenal for my mother from what she has told me.
-edit- I don't think I really get what your point is?
Nowadays Apple is an affordable car. Tesla may one day be an affordable car.
Tesla is an extremely expensive car. Especially if you consider its value-to-price.
And, obviously, different people assign different value to the car. The 97% of owners who'd buy again probably don't agree with you.
Tesla was founded on selling cars to a wealthy niche market.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Motors
"Tesla's primary goal was to commercialize electric vehicles, starting with a premium sports car aimed at early adopters and then moving as rapidly as possible into more mainstream vehicles, including sedans and affordable compacts"
https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-... (August 2, 2006)
Let's keep Hacker News grounded in reality, please.
I looked up the price points, they are accurate... so fuck you and your condescending tone.
Another take is that Tesla is a company that's doing what it needs to, to get into a position where they can sell affordable cars to low-to-middle class people.
But damn Elon Musk, that nasty capitalist oppressor pig that abuses poor people by pricing his cars higher than they can afford, just like Motorola when selling their first mobile phone http://mashable.com/2014/03/13/first-cellphone-on-sale/ .. those filthy bastards!
Workers Unite!
I'm not sure what you mean with "value-to-price", but aren't pretty much all Tesla owners in love with their cars? They seem to be valued very highly, and considered worth the price.
My point is.
They. Are. Not. Within. The. Price. Range. Of. The. Middle. Class...
Apple. Computers. Were.
Particularly if you look at it from a price-to-value standpoint of someone balancing a budget for a car. Luxury, ascetic, and cool-factor do not play a huge roll in that. Maybe they do in your life and then you are most likely either single, upperclass, or bad with money. The first two are ok, expensive luxury vehicles are ok. Am I touching a nerve here?
Value is subjective, by the way.
That means that if a Tesla costs $70k and someone buys one, then he demonstrably values the Tesla higher than his $70k, which means it's safe to say he considers a Tesla worth the price.
> maybe even "objectively"(lol...) nicer than other sports/luxury cars
Nope, not "lol". For example, Teslas are objectively safer than other cars. That's because they can be constructed to be like that because they're electric vehicles, but that doesn't make it any less objectively true.
Also, there's no problem with someone having the money and wanting something luxurious. The fact that some people do is the reason why lots of jobs involved in serving their wants exist, which surely you'd agree is a good thing.
(So basically: Teslas getting bought for their current prices is a Good Thing for us little folks, so I'm not sure what your problem is)
> My point is. [..] They. Are. Not. Within. The. Price. Range. Of. The. Middle. Class... [..] Apple. Computers. Were.
If both of those claims are true, then you've established that "Tesla is not like Apple that way". But is that what you mean?
It seems you're more concerned with some other people being able to afford Teslas than whether Tesla is like Apple that way.
> if you look at it from a price-to-value standpoint
Again, what the hell does "price-to-value" mean?
> Maybe they do in your life and then you are most likely either single, upperclass, or bad with money.
Huh? If someone buys a Tesla, it most definitely doesn't follow that he's bad with money.
> The first two are ok, expensive luxury vehicles are ok. Am I touching a nerve here?
Did you accidentally a word there? But no, you're not touching a nerve. I'd like to have a Tesla for myself, in the right circumstances (which don't even currently apply), but I couldn't afford one anyway.
That's perfectly fine with me though. It's alright that I don't have one, and it's fine I wouldn't even have the money. It's also perfectly fine that some others do, and buy them. If that touches a nerve with you, then there's something wrong with your nerves.
The Article says Tesla is following a similar business model as Apple. I disagree, Tesla's business model, at least currently, is to sell expensive cars to a wealthy niche while Apple's business model was to sell computers to the middle class.
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> Maybe they do in your life and then you are most likely either single, upperclass, or bad with money.
There is an Or in that statement. However if someone who earns 60 to 100k buys a Tesla, then yes they are bad with money.
So for instance saying that the low cost competitor couldn't afford to spend a little more on quality is dead wrong. If the customer you select values cost over quality (I'm not even looking into customer intimacy, the third discipline he misses) the are willing to pay a premium upfront for a product that is affordable over the lifetime (Total Cost of Ownership). That's why even in the volume market it is not always the one with the lower price to win. And different company could compete carving out a little different market.
Apple is for sure in the quality area. Tesla? My guess is that Tesla is in the Total Cost of Ownership, so totally different business model. Look how much they stress on the lower maintenance cost. Look at the direct distribution model that cut the costs down. Look at the free recharge at their supercharger network. Look at the calculator on how much you save buying a Tesla. Want more details? Their new battery factory will produce battery also for competitors to get to a scale big enough to reduce price. They open sourced their patents so other company will use their technology de facto increasing the consumption of component they need (lowering the price) and doing R&D with them.
Another aspect, Tesla is pretty much a vertically integrated company, even in a market where sourcing component and sharing platform is common, they produce a lot in house (e.g: the batteries). This is common when you look for the lower Total Cost of Ownership (it's in contrast with management mantra, all people that read just the first chapter of Traecy Wiersema book and not the next 19). On the opposite Apple outsource a lot even in a market where outsourcing is common. They do this to get the best component from the producer that happens to be able to provide it.
I know my analysis seems to be counter-intuitive, but if understanding and replicating Apple's business model (or Amazon, Tesla, Southwest, Nordstrom) was easy and intuitive I guess there will be no more Apple. I'm not even saying that I'm 100% right, to be fair...
[1]https://hbr.org/1993/01/customer-intimacy-and-other-value-di...
If those are the key advantages, Tesla might be in trouble when Apple releases their own electric car. Apple already has the "quality" brand, and has much more capital.
But there's a problem. There is just so much R&D being done in energy storage devices and battery technology that Tesla will need to do quite a bit of M&A in order to stay relevant. That's a weird thing to do whilst you are still selling cars.
The challenge with energy storage is not only in the R&D, but also in the manufacturing at scale, cars are a great avenue to approach this challenge.
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