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Comment by stephenr | Hacker News Reader

I think this is unfortunately why people get a bad idea about an IDE.

I don't want a tab or button for everything. I want to primarily write text (i.e. code) but I also want it to be intelligent about what I'm writing - i.e. I want the autocomplete, the parameter hinting, the type checking (i.e. can't use the result of a void method, or can't do string ops on an array etc). I also want the option to have refactor helpers (moving methods, renaming methods, changing argument order, etc).

I've found IDEA (and before that PhpStorm, but it supports less plugins) are generally able to meet that need but you have to be careful about which plugins you install. I want Lua support, that doesn't mean I want a Lua console button in all projects.

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You should have a look at QtCreator which follows a minimal IDE philosophy. The only downside is that it's only for C++.

I don't write C++ or even C, so I doubt that's going to work.

Unfortunately the only IDE's which seem to support languages I use and work on OS X are java based, and it seems the best option is IDEA or one of it's siblings.

Most IDEs can thankfully be trimmed down to look like QtCreator.

I daily write in Xcode and that is very slimmed-down. In fact, Visual Studio developers typically hate it on first using it because there is only editors on the screen as opposed to property panes both sides of the editor!

And I would say that it is ONLY C++ is truly a benefit to QtCreator!! No use trying to be everything to everyone. Plus, C++ is the best language for everything isn't it? (I jest, I jest)

But eclipse (and I'm sure others) used to allow you to hide most of the stuff, is the problem just the initial perception?

Customizable? but is it easy? Is there a drag'n'drop for the toolbar buttons? Can the fonts for menus and panel titles be downsized easily?

Also, Eclipse tends to try to do everything in their IDE: Transition an issue, commit, execute a command-line program, browse the database, etc. It's a very different spirit from, say, SublimeText where each program is dedicated to one thing well. It has a lot of impact on the UI, hence the critics "Code is 40% of my screen". I personally prefer IDEA now because it comes with thin shims.

Btw, the HN rules say "No negativity". Just a reminder to be considerate for the Eclipse team.

> Eclipse tends to try to do everything in their IDE

Isn't that the whole point of an IDE? I mean, an Integrated Development Environment, by definition, should have all the tools integrated, as opposed to a text editor which is only one tool in an unintegrated development environment.

I prefer Emacs myself, but if I wanted an IDE, I'd probably go for the one that can do everything I want to do.

Other comments say they prefer the axiom "IDE==awesome autocompletion" (e.g. LightTable) rather than "IDE==Embed all the tools into one window!".

I have worked in IT services companies. They wrap almost a full OS into Eclipse (or WSAD). They have people who don't have a clue about programming [1], they need to onboard them and they do little to upgrade their knowledge. I used to wonder how architects learnt about Git and Maven, until the day I decided not to use IDE buttons, tried them on the command line and discovered "--help". It's all self-documented, output is all logged, I can debug compilation errors alone!

[1] Recruitment and HR is a cost center for consultancies. At one point they just took graduates from Chemistry major with a mild interest in Excel. Needless to say those who stayed became PMs. I've seen millions of euros from government, banks and insurances thrown into multiplying employees, rather than improving employees.

I suspect there are very few programmers who want to click a Copy button on a toolbar with a mouse. Those sorts of tools should be hidden by default, at the very least.

My comment was related to having all tools built into the IDE rather than using lots of different command line (or other) tools, not to the UI buttons.

That's true. E.g., this is my Eclipse setup: http://i.imgur.com/SP6o1W2.png

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