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Comment by csomar | Hacker News Reader

The next part is to set the price for the job. Usually I would say: Ok, data scrape will cost you $75.

That's still ridiculously low by any measure. I wouldn't take you seriously at that price point. Because, here is why: I was charging that much 5 or 6 years ago.

How about $7,500 for manual data scraping?

On a related note. A friend of mine asked the other day if I can develop for him a GPS/Google maps solution that would take 6 months to develop for a serious Full-Stack developer.

He works on a multi-billion dollar company but he wants the solution for himself to show off his productivity to his bosses. He wants it on a "$50" budget.

I'm guessing you have fallen at the same scenario where the lady is paying it from her pocket instead of big corp bank account.

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He lives in the Phillipines, which obviously changes the scale of cost.

I had done this a few times in the past and would routinely charge just $100 for scrapes because I had written a robust enough application that the actual work involved (creating a manifest file) took about 5 minutes. I was attempting to work at scale.

Eventually I just got sick of oDesk. I had a regular job and was just looking for beer money anyway and the vast majority of jobs were essentially content stealing for some half-assed SEO purpose. I'd ask people if they'd read the TOS of the site in question and that's when communication would stop. Or they'd come and say "how about $15" and then I would quit communicating.

The lesson is good here - this site (and others like it) are filled with cheap, low-skilled programmers and clients with iffy intentions.

I'll also say that "5 star" doesn't mean much on this site. Reputation is established not by merely having a good aggregate score.

yes, I have similar experience, I just developed own python scraping solution to automate the process. But many of clients want script plus data and willing to pay only $15.

People want stuff for free. The web is free. They expect next to free for skills that take at least 10 years to actually master. Skill level similar to a doctor.

Damn you, giving me an additional boost to my already large ego. I'm one of those programmers who considers my skills to be more developed than most of my co-workers - I've met 4 people throughout my career whom I consider to be as good as or better than me. I never thought to compare my experience against that which a doctor goes through.

Ironic considering my language of choice is laughed at by "true developers". It's true that I consider my skill set to be above the people I've worked with, but I know there are millions of developers out there who outshine me in what one might call real development. I am both proud and jealous, but I like the comparison of a seasoned developer being similar to a doctor. It's true that it takes 10-20 years to have a solid understanding of what one is doing. Interesting analogy.

> I've met 4 people throughout my career whom I consider to be as good as or better than me.

You need to start hanging out with smarter people.

Because developers keep telling everyone who will listen "anyone can learn to code!" and "software should be free!".

Even if it were true, no doctor or lawyer would be stupid enough to openly say it.

>They expect next to free for skills that take at least 10 years to actually master.

You compare it to a doctor, but really it is more like that of a driver. Most of the people are only concerned about getting from point A to point B. They don't really care about proper cornering techniques or following the best line..

99% of what a doctor does is repetitive. Every year the next batch of new parents come in with the same problems with their kids and get the same prescriptions, people break arms and legs, get flu, have headaches, etc etc. Most people just want to be told what pill to take, they don't care about neuropharmacology or myocardial infractions.

Unpopular opinion here... Anyone can be a doctor!

I've had multiple health problems over the years that I've cured by doing the proper research online. Most doctors wouldn't even consider the solutions that helped me because they're always just looking to prescribe a pill. They fix the symptoms and not the cause. You're better off acting as your own doctor, unless you have some traumatic injury that requires surgery.

Disclaimer: This comment is not medical advice. The information presented above is not presented with the intention of diagnosing or treating any disease or condition. This information is for educational purposes only. No responsibility is assumed by the author nor anyone connected with this website for the use of this information and no guarantees of any kind are made for the performance or effectiveness of the recommendations provided.

... and people have to leave a disclaimers like that when they say something like I did. Why don't non-programmers have to leave disclaimers? Our profession is more legit than modern medical practice. I can't wait until expert systems and robots replace doctors!

What health problems did you cure by doing online research, without medication?

You're partway right. A real world example I had back in college - heartburn. Doc's solution is take a pill when needed (the part thats left over - for the rest of your life). The solution I found online is - change your diet. After a few years of experimenting, I fixed the root cause of my issue, and don't have to be reliant on pills as much as I was before. Obviously this is not applicable to all cases, but the point to take from this is that you need to manage your own health.

A driver? Well, I think a better comparison would be to watchmaking or other crafts that require deep understanding and great attention to details.

Deep understanding? Really? I don't think so. For example, You can do a lot of web application development with out actually knowing the first thing about the request/response cycle..

I clicked through the the article, verified that the title was the same as HN, read the early line "Couple days ago some R.D. from United States contacted me. She wanted to do website scrape.". I stopped reading. Clickbait, ignorant of real freelance work, thinks being contacted about a pathetic scraping job means freelance is worthless? Give me a break. Become a real developer who can find real clients worth the effort, and freelance is 100% viable. How the hell is this getting any traction? Puh-please.

Hi real developer. Please give me advice how to become real python developer. I just started to learn python from scratch, I've developed my first django website ( http://review.food-singapore.com/ ). I have developed many scripts/scrapers (but seems that's just pathetic) And now when I'm trying to apply any full time python job, almost all require link to github/some project which I don't have. How to get any real python position?

I'm not developer1, but I'm happy to give you some pointers. My email address is in my profile.

Why not put your scripts and scrapers on github?

thanks! About scripts I think they won't be useful for anyone, because most of them are like: "scrape all apps from app store", "scape 30 million business profiles from website A.", etc. But anyway will try to put some :)

It would be great if they would be useful for somebody, but here you are just trying to impress would-be employers.

Zed Shaw's course of course is an option

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