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Comment by anonuser910 | Hacker News Reader

Not a fan of CodeCademy. Other than the obvious (look who's backing them) though unacknowledged objective of flooding the market with low-quality devs to suppress wages, I've seen too many complaints from users to the effect of "I completed all of the exercises, but I feel like I haven't really learned anything."

Too much hand-holding. A good book, a comprehensive tutorial, or even just reading the documentation still probably works best.

In fact, this training wheels-tutorial system, regardless of its effectiveness, fits perfectly with their goal of devaluing software engineers (whom they deign only to describe as coders); after all, if "Coding is sooo Easy!!!" it shouldn't require one to read dozens of thick books, right? Just playing a sort of game and "leveling up" every now and then should suffice. Then you too will be a coder - and Zuck will be richer.

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Sure, you're not going to be a professional software engineer working on complex problems and scaling servers at Google, but you can learn a little something from their service. For beginners who have never programmed I think its great because you can program right in the browser; no need to install compilers/interpreters, text editors/IDEs, DBMSs or servers. These things can take well over an hour to install, configure, and learn how to navigate through. All of this getting thrown at a beginners face would do nothing but discourage them.

And even if you're a well experienced programmer, you can use Codecademy to get your feet wet in a new language. I don't see the harm in this.

tl;dr "omg I'm scared of new people learning how to program because it threatens my job. I learned the hard way looking through old textbooks and new entrants shouldn't get to use a nice new service to learn because I didn't have that available to me when I started!"

Programming has always been accessible to new people. The only way it couldn't be is if programmers had organized themselves into some sort of union and then sought and received for it a legal monopoly on their profession as enjoyed by the American Dental Association.

And yes, I am afraid of CodeCademy, bootcamps, H-1Bs visas, and any other scheme blessed by industry, the media, and government that seems tailor-made for reducing my wages and my prestige. Remember that it wasn't long ago that a massive wage suppression cartel in SV was exposed, and its architects were punished with mere wrist-slaps. Quite frankly, you're foolish if you're not afraid.

Further, who are these "new people" you speak of anyway? Most of the "old people" I've met in this industry are there because they love programming, with the high salary being something of a perk. That's why so many of them contribute to open source projects on the side. This new breed of bootcamp and CodeCademy graduates are thoroughly mercenary in character. One of CodeCademy's own success stories is from a lawyer who got into "coding" because the job market for lawyers was so poor - why should I contribute to my own marginalization by supporting people like him?

That's a really naive assessment of his comment. I share a similar sentiment as the OP here, programming (not coding) is hard. A lot of us get paid well to solve complex problems for clients who expect us to do the job right. Institutions like codecademy, and other "learn to code" incentives make it seem like you can just knock some achievements off a list and bang, you're on the way to being a programmer!

Having spent a lot of time around industry vets and people who started doing this stuff in the 80s, these "nice new services" aren't all they're cracked up to be. The freelance coder market is becoming an annoying thing for the reputation of programmers, consultants and companies who know their shit, and do a great job for their paying customers.

Also, as I stated in my post, I don't think CodeCademy actually works that well at all, so your suggestion that I'm envious of new people because they have access to CC when starting out while I didn't is groundless. I tried one of their courses two years ago and found it extremely shallow. If someone asked me today how to learn JavaScript, I would probably direct them to Mozilla's tutorial or to the Rhino book and wouldn't even mention CC.

The glut of free programming books and tutorials on the internet along with open source operating systems and development tools and the Stack Overflow and other Stack Exchange websites have collectively done much more programming and CS education than CC has done and likely ever will do.

So you don't personally like CC based on your experience of it 2 years ago, so what? You don't have to use it. It just so happens that a lot of people really like their service.

If it outputs bad candidates, as you claim, then you should have no problem beating them in job interviews.

This is awfully cynical. I really don't see a problem with teaching people how to code, even if they don't become masters on their first try.

If a self proclaimed 'engineer' provides the same value as someone who leveled up on Code Academy, then they rightly should be replaced.

> Other than the obvious (look who's backing them)

O'Reilly and a bunch of VC firms? That's all I could find on their website.

http://www.wired.com/2014/11/reskillusa/

"Coding education has taken off in recent years, driven by reports that the demand for quality programmers in America is drastically outpacing the supply. So everyone from the White House to Google has jumped on the coding bandwagon"

Funny, when demand outpaces supply, aren't prices supposed to rise?

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